An Open Letter from a PTA Mom to Mike Huckabee: A Message for Those Who Long for God’s Presence in Schools

By Kimberly Burkett

Dear Mr. Huckabee,

We all share in great sorrow and grief from last week’s horrific events in Newtown, CT. I would like to think that it was overwhelming sadness from the loss of life that led you to state on Friday that the reason behind the mass killings of first graders and their educators was we have “systematically removed God” from public schools. I would like to think profound sorrow and shock were the reason for your misguided remarks. Unfortunately, cynicism leads me to believe that you made such statements for political posturing or perhaps to keep up with the conservative radio shock jocks.

Regardless of your motivation, I want to suggest that you visit your local public school before passing such judgment in the future. If you visited a neighborhood elementary school like Sandy Hook, or any public school for that matter, you would see that God’s presence and the teachings of Jesus Christ are well represented by the works of the people in those buildings. Now perhaps His presence isn’t seen in the way you want – there aren’t readings from the Bible (or any other religious texts for that matter) and the Ten Commandments aren’t posted in classrooms (nor are the Pillars of Islam, actually), but His presence and teachings are instead practiced, demonstrated, and felt. You see, Mr. Huckabee, if you visited the schools you quickly denounce for removing your symbols of God, you’d find that His work actually takes places there every day.

For many students, that public school you deride is their only constant; their only refuge; their only normalcy. Like educators across the nation, my elementary school principal husband and his staff work daily with homeless children, hungry children, abused children, broken children. He and his staff feed their bodies, characters, minds, and souls. They do it every day. They do it for little pay and they do it for lousy benefits. They do it despite the disrespect they sometimes feel from parents and the public. They do it in the face of disdain from politicos that claim they’re fleecing taxpayer money and don’t contribute revenue to the economy. They do it even as they’re called “union thugs.” Educators are God’s workers – there’s no other reason to think a person would endure so much to receive so little.

These educators, aided by school support staff and parent/community volunteers, are God-given, Mr. Huckabee. Through them God’s miracles happen every day. Through education, God’s children are provided a shot at a better life. In my state of Texas, 25% of children live in poverty (the statistics in your home state of Arkansas are similar). For some of these children, these educators are the only chance they have of breaking the poverty cycle. In those Godless government schools, they have a chance at a better tomorrow. The school is a place where they can not only explore their life’s dreams, but be provided the tools to achieve those dreams. It is the tireless men and women of the school systems that will give them those tools.

And these educators wear many hats – not only do they educate and lead, they serve as role models, protectors, life coaches, and cheerleaders. They’re in loco parenti. They’re friends and counselors. Unfortunately, some in Connecticut even served as human shields – coming between bullets and six year olds. If serving children and the community in this way isn’t the work of a higher power, I don’t know what is.

Perhaps your efforts would be better spent, Mr. Huckabee, not in trying to bring your particular brand of religion into schools or dictating how God should appear in a classroom, but instead supporting public schools and the work He does through them. Education budgets have been slashed nationwide. Our students learn in over-crowded classrooms with outdated technology. Our teachers are being pushed out of the profession by unrealistic accountability systems and the profit-driven thirst to change classrooms into testing factories. Our state legislatures are bowing down to special interests seeking to privatize our education systems – turning a noble profession and public commitment into little more than a profitable pick for a hedge fund manager. Through systematic defunding, the decline of critical thinking skills to make way for rote memorization to pass the next benchmark test, and the political prostitution of public education for profit, the war on education is clear and ongoing. God’s work through these schools and educators is under attack, but your concern is reciting scripture in the classroom. Really?

Mr. Huckabee, why are you and other sanctimonious detractors more concerned that educators don’t lead children in prayer instead of sharing concern for the many challenges that schools and impoverished children face daily? Why are you saddened that children aren’t taught Biblical parables instead of uplifted by the miracles that occur in schools every day? If you don’t see God in the efforts and works of schools and educators, I’m afraid you’re not really looking.

You see, Mr. Huckabee, schools don’t need to preach the Gospel or read the Bible every day to bring God into the classroom. He never left.

Sincerely,

PTA Mom

  • Mike Huckabee: Schools are a ‘Place of Carnage’ because We Removed God from Them (patheos.com)
  • Huckabee Blames Shooting on Removing God from Schools (politicalwire.com)
  • Huckabee: I Didn’t Mean Prayer In School Would Have Stopped Newtown School Shooting; I Meant More Christianity (newshounds.us)
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868 thoughts on “An Open Letter from a PTA Mom to Mike Huckabee: A Message for Those Who Long for God’s Presence in Schools

  1. First of all this world and schools have tooken god out of these things. Why? Because simply people believe god is not everything when in reality he’s all we have. People have criticized god have told schools they don’t want there kids learning about god and a whole lot of other things. But as soon as bad things happen people blame god and ask where was he? Not all people are the same, but for the people that don’t care about god and blame everything on him are the ones that question him the most. “Where are you god?” He’s there alright he’s just always tired of you calling him when you need something and not thanking him for what he has gave you and helped you with. So ask yourself this. Do I really know god or do I just know him when I need too.

  2. Love, love, love. I had just had a conversation with my sister right before I read your article. She is a teacher at a Christian school and I am a teacher in a public school. We were disagreeing about being able to teach about God in schools. She says I can’t teach the scriptures as well as she can. I disagree. Your article confirms my exact thoughts and feelings. Thank you!!!

  3. Beautifully written. If only Mr.Huckabee would take the time to read and learn from this our world would be one step closer to the teachings of Christianity.

  4. Pingback: From a PTA mom « and sure stars shining . . .

  5. Pingback: ABENDing » Response to Mike Huckabee’s “Where Was God?”

  6. God has been ousted from our PUBLIC schools by OUR government. So, not only are the children in peril, so are all support staff. They may be Godly people but, as all Christians know, this will not save an earthly life when the devil has stepped in and filled the void left where God once was, but is no longer permitted.

    • How can people not see how schools have changed since we asked God to leave them. Yes, people can do godly things, but that is not the same. A lot of people medicate their children when all they need is to have “recess” to run off energy. How about bringing the focus on mental health & changing laws in order to take care of the mental patients & hospitals for the ones who need them. We’ve invited God out of our schools & are fighting to take him out of everything in order to be a secular nation.

      • I have questions for you and the poster above: Whose God? Which tradition? Which book?

        The truth is that this is not a Christian nation, nor are our public schools segregated by religious belief. I suggest you read the above article again, with an eye toward God’s work rather than required ritual/text.

        Also, as God is omnipotent, omnipresent, and omniscient, I doubt God is able to be forcibly kept out of any school. The difference is that I see God’s presence in goodness and kindness and the elevating of souls, minds and bodies, and you see God’s presence only in words spoken from your preferred version of the Bible or in rituals from your preferred belief system.

      • You’re missing a big part of the point. She’s asking him to focus on why schools aren’t working and how we can change the many issues…like teaching to a textbook and basing pay (and school funding) on these tests. I would be a bit nervous to give my students the recess they need when my rear is on the line that they pass their reading test.
        God will be there for the people who believe and won’t be ‘there’ for the people who don’t. Forcing children to read scripture in schools isn’t going to change their thought on religion. It’s sad how close minded our country still is. It’s 2013, not 1876. No amount of forced religion was going to make me a Christian or a religious follower of any faith really. But am I a bad person? No. Are there bad Christians? Jews? Muslims? Yes, Yes, Yes. Are there bad ‘Non believers’? Yes.

  7. This is a wonderful letter. What a fantastic writer you are! Having read the following exchange of comments, all I can say is that it has been quite a discussion. All of you who disagree with Ms. Kimberly have a right to express your opinions. Just remember that the other side has the same right. If Mr. Huckabee wants to speak his mind, he must be prepared for others to speak their minds back. We all must be accountable for what we say–not just what we MEAN, but also what others THINK we mean. Mr. Huckabee makes it his business to speak for the entire Christian community–I, for one, wish he would not. Anyone sharing an OPINION on matters of faith and morals ought to make it clear that his own beliefs don’t necessarily represent those of the rest of us. I am a Christian, and I believe evil and violence are the result of a broken world, not of any district policy, lawsuit, war on religion, or government legislation. Ms. Kimberly is correct. Actions DO speak louder than words, and the public schools–though flawed–are filled with His works daily. Thank you, Ms. Kimberly, for sharing.

    • Utterly fantastic. I’m a teacher, and a Christian, and I thank you from the bottom of my heart for what you’ve said here.

    • Twenty-five years working with young adult offenders. Bibical principles were taught on a daily basis. These folk only went to church services to get out of the dorm. Still they respected the idea of fair play and being treated like they were important. There is a saying, “You can take the boy out of the country but you can’t take the country out of the boy.” The same goes for Christian teaching. No matter what the gov’t takes away from me they cannot take away my belief that there is a Higher Power and my knowledge that I am responsible for my thoughts and deeds.Thank you Ms. Kimberly for your stand for honesty and freedom.

  8. Pingback: A Response to the Sandy Hook Elementary School Shooting | Multiple Pathways

  9. Mile, I totally agree with everything you said. Thanks for the direct QUOTES, that clarify EXACTLY WHAT WAS SAID!!!
    Brooklyn you are doing the SAME exact thing the author did. You ended the quote before it ended to make it say just what you wanted it to! It’s unbelievable how many people do this to support their belief!!! If you are going to use a quote AGAINST someone…at LEAST have the courtesy to quote them COMPLETELY.
    ~Cindy

    • Anyone who claims that Huckabee didn’t say God has been systematically pushed out of the public schools, etc., is just plain wrong. That was the entire point of his remarks. Please take your blunders off and be honest with yourselves and others. It’s un-Christian not to. For those of you claiming that he didn’t say “God has been systematically removed from our schools,” what do you think his main point was? Sheesh.

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  11. the only thing I will say is maybe you all should listen more closely to Mike Huckabee’s words. He said and I quote “It’s far more than just taking prayer and bible reading out of the schools. It’s the fact that people sue a city so that we aren’t confronted with a manger scene or a CHRISTMAS carol. That lawsuits are filed to remove a cross that is a memorial to fallen soldiers. Churche’s and christian owned business’ are told to surrender their value’s under the edict of government orders to provide tax funded abortion pills. We CAREFULLY and INTENTIONALLY stopped saying things that are sinful and we call them disorders, sometimes we even say they are normal.” I just DO NOT see where some of you say that he is saying that God is not in our schools. It is WAYYYYY beyond keeping prayer or bible reading in our schools. We have deleted the pledge of allegiance TO OUR COUNTRY because it has ONE word in it that MAY or MAY NOT be offensive to certain people….GOD. Personally that word is not “offensive” to me at all. I have a wife that is Pagan, Should I not be with her because she believes differently than I do? I as a CHRISTIAN say no. i WOULD LOVE for her to be able to join me in heaven but then again THAT”S NOT MY CHOICE is it??? I have always said I was not put on this earth to judge, I was put on this earth to BE JUDGED BY MY LORD. I just hope and sincerely hope that I make him proud and he lets me into his kingdom when I get to that stage.

    • He also said ” I think god did show up. He showed up in the lives of TEACHERS that put their lives in between a gunman and their students” So I can really not see how this PTA mom can say that he doesn’t realize that God wasn’t there. The attacking of other’s, needs to stop and we all need to have some patience and understanding of what others have to say and the biggest thing, I see that is really missing here, that is RESPECT for others and their opinions. PLEASE people STOP slandering each other and start RESPECTING each other. That is what God would EXPECT from each and every one of us to do.

      • But he DID say God was not in the schools. His whole entire point was to point that out: “We ask why there is violence in our schools, but we have systematically removed God from our schools.” The author was listening, just like the rest of the country was. He essentially blamed violence in the schools on the systematic removal of God from them. That much is clear. And freedom of speech is a double-edged sword. It goes both ways. The first amendments doesn’t protect us from criticism, and my take is that if Huckabee wants to dish it out, he should man up and take the criticism like a big boy. So some people think he’s stupid–So what? He thinks they’re stupid, so it really boils down to a difference of opinions, and everybody’s entitled to his/her own. That’s why I’m proud to be a citizen. God bless America, and pray for Newtown, CT.

  12. Why has the main focus of the story changed, and why are people now attacking each other, trying to win points off each other? Different people will have a different take on this, and we can’t all have the same take. None is necessarily wrong, for having an opinion different to what we believe in.
    Are you trying to tell me that if an aetheist made a comment regarding what he thought was the underlying problem leading to the many shootings over the last 200 years, that his opinion would be less valid just because he did not believe in God. **Think about that sentence for a moment**
    Americans need to wake up and ask yourselves some serious soul searching questions. It doesn’t serve anyone attaching this one or that one. kids died and hundreds of kids out there are still at risk. If no body acts, another massacre WILL take place, and even if you pray/ not, there are no guarantees that it won’t be your child. (How many people who died in 9/11 were Christians, Muslims, Jews, Hindu’s)The problem remains, and something MUST be done, URGENTLY. What must America do, and do so soon, to prevent or at least significantly reduce such loss of its life. Instead of fighting and bickering online about religion etc, concerted effort is required to FORCE your government to do something NOW

  13. To sum up all the back and forth- PTA Mom is right in that many teachers are the hands and feet of Christ in their actions, caring for the kids. But Mike Huckabee is also right in that the school Systems have been trying to keep Christianity out. Too many stories of kids being told they can not write about Jesus for an aritcle on ” Who Do You Admire” or similar topic. Told they can not have a Bible on their desk or wear a cross necklace or a T shirt with Christian words , etc. If the teachers are such representatives of Christ in the schools , then why don’t they stand up to the unions and administrations who misinterpret the constitution and what it allows and does not. Both sides have their point and have to work together to solve the problem.

    • If students free speech or religious rights are inhibited, ie not being allowed to wear a cross, carry a Bible, etc. I would suggest they contact the ACLU which has successfully stood up for these rights and won.

  14. I pledge allegiance to the flag
    of the United State of America
    and to the Republic, for which it stands
    One Nation under God,
    Indivisible,
    with liberty and justice for all

    It really is that simple. I don’t listen to much of the rhetoric on either side. I don’t need to NPR, Fox, CBS, CNN, or anyone else to guide me as to what is right and wrong. It would seem that the criticism of removing Christianity (yes, Christianity, not religion. We do mean the Christian God. You are welcome to worship as you see fit, but I don’t see an issue with demanding respect of our beliefs, regardless of what yours may be. We respect your right to believe what you want, and we will all have to deal with it in our own way at the end.) is not a criticism of teachers and schools, but rather a criticism of politics and the political correctness plague that has caused us to move so far from the ideals of of our fathers and grandfathers. Not saying something just because you do not want to take a chance does not change the facts, nor the truthfulness or lies that it may be. It simply dumbs down the world by not allowing people to discuss their ideas, their morals, their religion, and their views. It is no wonder many do not know how to express themselves. I love the USA and will gladly defend her, our freedom, and our liberty. Yet, I am appalled that we are not allowed to proudly proclaim the pledge of allegiance on a daily basis, or post the ten commandments in our courthouses. I am appalled that it is now Happy Holidays instead of Merry Christmas. I am appalled that it appears the majority wants the few elected officials to command and legislate every aspect of our life. Obviously we feel that they are either smarter and better than us, or that we are not capable of directing our own lives without their assistance. Will our society every again subscribe to responsibility and citizenship? Probably not, because we all have our own agendas and our own lives, and those are more important than anything else. Thank God our fathers and grandfathers and their families were not that way. The sacrifices that were made for the American Revolution, the American Civil War, WWII, and countless other historic moments that required self sacrifice, leadership, and putting the interest of the Country ahead of each of our own petty lives had died along with so many of the rights and privileges that our fathers and grandfathers fought and sacrificed so much so that we could have them.

    But I do digress. How dare someone criticize schools or teachers, they are perfect and accomplishing their attended mission with honors.

    Disclaimer – As with all professions, there are good, mediocre, and bad everywhere. Thank you to the selfless teachers who do go out daily and do their best to present a role model with a strong character, high moral standards, and the knowledge of hope. Thank you for passing along your knowledge, wisdom and experience, especially with the lack of support and resources that should be given to assist you. Hopefully teachers like you will touch the leaders of tomorrow. Hopefully they will learn of the need for leadership, self sacrifice, and the need to stand tall for their beliefs against a wave of political correctness.

    • Frank, where do you get the idea that the Pledge of Allegiance is not said in schools? I currently have 2 children in school and they say it EVERY DAY with the words “one nation under God” included. Oh yea, they also have a moment of silence that can be used for prayer. Though as a Christian we can prayer anywhere or anytime that is needed…..

      • Frank aint listening unfortunately or anyone like Frank. You see they cannot think outside the box they have packed themselves into. They have become robots that cannot be re-programed because they lack the “hardware” to do so. They will just keep on preaching and beating the bible rightously away with their blinders on to what the true meaning of a Christian is. They did it during the Crusades, they felt themselves rightous to kill anyone who did not adopt their Christian ways. Look into what the “rigtous” Quakers did in Salem and other areas. There is no one as dangerous as someone who is insecure and unsure of what they feel they should be. They will committ the most henious crimes in the name of their beliefs and claim they are truly rightous. They will say there is a war on Christmas even though most never encountr being told they cannot say Merry Christmas and even have it said back to them. They will not be able to see the fairness in since it is a Christian holiday it should be kept in the churchs, private Christian schools and if the retail owner so wants out of his business. They have to lord it over everyone or they just can’t be happy just celebrating with like believers. it is hard to wrap you mind around I know because it seems so simple and easy to understand,a measure of common sense and maybe a lick of “common” decency is all it takes to understand this. No, it won’t matter if they go shopping for two weeks straight and not one person tells them they can’t say Merry Christmas and every clerk in every store says it to them or back to them they will still claim “and, and your not allowed to say Merry Christimas…..” I tell you I believe in my God and Jesus more then I ever have in my entire life at this point in my life. My belief is so much more real now then when I was young and narrow mindedly thought all must be just like me to be rightous. When you rid yourself of all that self rightous judmental and smug way of thinking then and only then is when you are truly free to feel what you believe the most intensely because then and only then is when it becomes personal, your own and not a popularity contest or rite of passage to belong to a group or bunch of people in order to fit in.

  15. Let me first start by saying, it is my job to teach my children about faith. It is the job of myself, my wife, our Church and our community. It is NOT the job of the school.

    Secondly, as the level of actual “education” is lessened thanks to the political driven agendas to have children gauged by test scores, I feel it will soon become my responsibility to teach my children as well. Fortunately I have been blessed to send my children to a school that happily accepts parent involvement and to me that helps me feel like I have at least a small voice in what is going on. It also has after school programs for faith, completely funded ad run by volunteers. Sadly, when no one is able to volunteer as I have seen this school year, the program is vacant. I hope that one day my schedule will allow me to volunteer.

    Lastly, regardless of what side you are on, Huckabee’s, PTA Mom, or any other, the complete disregard of others opinions or viewpoints and the constant belittling of others I have seen on here is disgusting. Debate is meant to allow diverse opinions to voice their viewpoint without fear of persecution and allow retort without making others feel stupid for their view. Almost every post or comment on here lacks integrity.

    Good luck to all of you. As for me and my house, we will serve The Lord.

  16. Let’s try an experiment. Eliminate teachers union’s dues from being automatically deducted from the teacher’s pay check. After a month or so, let’s see how many teachers voluntarily contribute tothe union. Once we identify those teachers who discontinue contributions, let’s see how many of those support the union agenda. Wow! Virtually none. In other words, these are the teachers who want to teach the children reading,writing and arithmetic not influenced by the radical left which espouses there is no God.

    • Michael, I truly believe that if you were a teacher you would not have posted your comment above. Please do some research on the teaching profession and the unions that support education. I am certain that you will find this to have little to do with politics or partisanship. Thank you.

      • I was a teacher in FL for 5 years. I had to leave the union due to the constant political ads for only selected candidates and also receiving a history timeline of the union who listed as their crowning achievement their influence in the election of Barack Obama. It was difficult decision as I taught in a tough urban school and gave up many protections.

  17. He doesn’t know, and he doesn’t care. He’s just on here picking a fight and falsely claiming to care about God’s word. Hey, Peter, for someone who “can go on all night,” you sure have clammed up. Cat got your tongue? Don’t you want to talk more about how morally, financially, and intellectually superior you are?

  18. Most of us Christians know that God is looking over Huckabee’s shoulder, just as he is the classrooms of all our schools. I know that He was crying at Sandy Hook Elementary as he helped the victims rise to Heaven, and I truly believe that he is crying at Huckabee’s side. We have much to learn about getting along with each other and protecting each other and sharing love instead of hate. God is trying to help us all–some are just not “getting it.”

  19. Dear PTA Mom:

    First of all, there are other people in this world whose opinions are just as valid as your own. Many of us believe public education is as outdated as the post office and we are all tired of watching you as you pathetically cling to the past.

    Let’s clarify a point so you can feel secure in your public school. We really don’t want to keep trying to force our God into your schools. We’ve accepted that will never happen with your agenda of diversity and inclusion. No, instead we think it’s time we have our own schools designed by us to coexist with your schools – and we’d like our taxes to go to our schools, not yours. You denounce the label of “union thug” but let’s look at it from our point of view for a change. A “thug” by definition is a robber, and public school unions lobby with big money to rob countless working families taking away their right to choose which school their tax dollars apply to. In our state, over 40% of our state budget goes to you and your public school unions. Many working class families just like mine forgo other luxuries in life because after we’re done supporting your school (which we have chosen not to send our kids to) we still need to adequately pay the wonderful staff at our private Christian schools. So what do we want? We want the right to fund our own schools with our own tax dollars, and if you ever allow us to choose, we’ll gladly remove the appropriate label of “union thug”. Until then, wear the label you’ve earned.

    The main points of your letter is that you say public schools are doing God’s work. Really? Although I agree that public school teachers do care about the kids they teach to say they are doing God’s work is quite a stretch! Doing God’s work would actually involve teaching them who He is and reading from his scripture at your schools which you freely admit you never do. Teaching about love without teaching about God may be the same to you but it is not the same to me and countless others. Love is more than giving kids hugs and telling them everything is okay. Clearly as we can see from Sandy Hook, not everything is okay. There actually is a standard or right and wrong. I know you think we are old fashioned, but many of us still believe it is important for a child to know their heavenly father and their purpose. We even put that truth ahead of earthly knowledge. So yes, that involves teaching the bible, introspection, judgment of one’s self, and the search for meaning. But we are more interested in raising a child of character because we care about who they becomes as adults more than what job skills they can obtain. At my son’s private school they teach reverence for God and love for each other because that’s what Jesus taught. They are taught to respect women, children and for every life whether born or unborn because it is precious to God. Contrast that with your public schools, where we don’t even call killing babies a sin anymore, we call it a woman’s choice. I’m not sure which part of God’s work that is, maybe you can point to a scripture for me? Then in the spirit of doing God’s work, your public schools call sex with people we hardly know “safe sex” as long as a tiny piece of rubber is involved. You teach children sex-ed, but when you take God and His purpose out of everything that is taught it’s no wonder kids having a warped perspective on sex, marriage and family. Do you ever wonder why our young men hide in the video game world to escape the world view you have taught them about?

    Bring on your reply PTA mom….I can go on all night.

    • Peter, just wondering… Is this your idea of defending the Christian viewpoint? If so, do you really think its a good way of bringing anyone around to Jesus’ way of thinking? What does your rant have to do with PTA mom’s letter anyway? Leave her alone. Bully.

      • So it is OK for PTA mom to reply to Mike Huckabee’s letter but we dare not reply to her letter? You ask us to only accept her worldview and if we disagree we are a bully? Nice try.

      • A teacher… the only bully’s here, are those of your ilk… who REFUSE to acknowledge that you are NOT the be all and end all of every opinion worthy of praise. That is why so many of us are simply fed up with the sanctimonious, self righteous attitude so many “teacher’s” spew. You are a teacher… that is it. You are NOT any better than any other profession. You do NOT have all the “correct” answers. You do NOT care more about the children of today than any other group of people. You DO think that you possess all of those virtues… but again… you do NOT!

      • Cheryl, you’re making a lot of assumptions about me . I’m not a teacher–I’m a parent (hence my anonymous screen name). As a parent, though, I consider myself to be my children’s ultimate “teacher.” So I don’t have any special agenda for defending teachers. However, I am also a Christian, and as such I choose to make people aware (when they decide to act rudely, calling teachers names and hurling insults at them for no reason) that their behavior is un-Christian. People who pretend to love God, yet write such hateful nonsense as Peter did, are hypocrites. PTA mom didn’t insult a single person with her letter. Peter Martin insulted teachers, public schools, taxpayers, and PTA mom herself, and as you can see from the comments on his letter, no one appreciated it. Freedom of opinion and expression of opinion is a wonderful thing, but it goes both ways. Freedom to say something is not the same thing as freedom from criticism. Everyone has a right to share their opinion. And others have a right to disagree. That’s just how it is. Sorry if my comments offended you.

      • On Saturday, December 22, 2012, Educate For Texas wrote: > A Teacher commented: “Cheryl, you’re making a lot of assumptions about me . I’m not a teacher–I’m a parent (hence my anonymous screen name). As a parent, though, I consider myself to be my children’s ultimate “teacher.” So I don’t have any special agenda for defending teacher” >

    • Peter, you don’t sound much like a Christian. Your response is mean-spirited and full of rage. Don’t you know not all people have the option of private school? Why do you feel the need to belittle those who are devoting their time and efforts to something noble like loving kids. I’m surprised you’ve even read the bible and come out so bitter and mean. Shame on you.

      • I agree. What a poor way to express God’s love. The author’s point was that Huckabee ignores all the good Gid does through teachers and chooses to focus on the more legalistic viewpoint. Exactly what Jesus hated. Sounds to me like Peter is a Pharisee. Send my kid to a private school and then insult and look down my nose at everyone else. Read the bible, Peter. You’re a legalist.

      • I welcome the dialogue because it’s one we need to have as a nation. Vince, ask yourself a question, what would be so wrong with allocating tax dollars to the schools of our choice? Then we would no longer have to bicker about what is being taught in the schools, because we would get to pick the one that aligns best with our desires as parents. Can you think of a better solution? Do you think that the bigger issue of one size fits all is working?

      • The biggest problem would be that an approach like that would leave a lot of children out in the cold. The average family can’t afford private school for their kids. In point of fact, the very first public schools were started so that all children could be educated regardless of their economic status. I truly believe Jesus would want me to sacrifice some of my own wealth to help all children get an education. Don’t you?

      • I have no children and will never have children but I do make a good living and am happy to contribute my tax dollars to the public school system. Why? Because educating the next generation benefits all of society, myself included. You will benefit from a future full of public school educated adults, not just your kids and their classmates. It’s all of our responsibility and choosing to only contribute to your school, tax-wise feels short-sighted and, yes, unChristian.

    • I’m not going to enter into a dialogue with you other than to submit this one comment. You are a bully because of the overbearing tone of your writing; the same is not true of PTA Mom. You are a bully because you write as though you know exactly who God is and what He wants; the same is not true of PTA Mom. In your world there is no place for those whose beliefs differ from yours; the same is not true of PTA Mom. Not content with tax exemption for your church, you want to voluntarily withdraw from the general education system and set up your own, then not contribute to the public one.

      My friend, you are in the wrong country. Why don’t you go somewhere else, where people of your ilk can band together without being handicapped by the rest of us? Somehow, I am reminded of the Pilgrims, who came to the New World in 1620 to escape being persecuted for their religion, then began persecuting all those who disagreed with them. If you want freedom for YOUR religion, then have the good grace and common sense to guarantee the same freedom for others. Freedom of religion does NOT mean that everyone is free just to share YOUR beliefs.

      • If you re-read my post, you’ll see that we both agree that religion should not be forced on anyone. I’m not trying to force Christianity on you, just advocating for school choice – what’s so oppressive about that? The system you are defending is doing just what you hate, forcing people of one belief to fund beliefs of another. Just re-read and take the emotion out of it.

    • Peter, I honestly don’t understand what your letter has to do with PTA mom’s. She was talking about a specific remark made by Mike Huckabee about the reason for the Sandy Hook massacre. Your letter is more to do with expressing your opinion about taxes, unions, etc. Are you defending Huckabee’s remarks? Or are you just taking out your hatred of the public school system on PTA mom? Because all she said was that the Sandy Hook shootings were not the result of religion being removed from the schools. If you think the shootings were indeed a result of godlessness in the public schools, what’s your opinion about if Christianity were fully endorsed? Would God then save us from tragedy and rescue us from all suffering?? Interested to know your opinion.

      • Charlotte:

        PTA mom was making an argument that although God is not taught He is “felt” in the public schools and that should satisfy Mike Huckabee and the rest of us. Well, I think we can do better. And in no way do I advocate pushing my beliefs on anyone else. This is America! But the way we fund public education is outdated, and it does not serve the nation as a whole. What if my taxes went to my Christian school, and there was a Jewish school, a tech school, and whatever else the market will bear? What would be so wrong with taking those billions of tax dollars and allocating them on a per student basis where they enroll? Would competition in education be so bad? Consider our current results and ask yourself if this would be any worse.

      • Notice how once again he refrains from answering anything meaningful. So what do you think, Peter? Would Jesus want us to give money to help all our kids get an education, or would He say, “Forget those little urchins–I’ve got mine, and that’s all that matters!” I wonder.

      • I’m talking about putting parents in charge of education. Who knows better than parents the best school for their child? Imagine a parent having numerous schools to choose from, then whichever they choose to enroll their child in, their tax dollars go to that school to support it. And here’s how you make it fair to give every child an equal opportunity. Even though we may pay different amounts into the tax system which I am OK with, we allocate the same tax dollars so each child would be treated equally. It really isn’t that crazy of a concept. Just makes so much sense doesn’t it?

    • Oh my Peter, your bullying misogyny has TOTALLY convinced me to return to the abusive relationship that is Christianity.

      How could I have been so foolish to run screaming from it over twenty years ago? Yeah, you sure showed me.

      • Peter, Thank you for a well written and apropos response. Although your detractors would love to have things their way, they are set in the group-think that is the public education system. They really do not believe it is failing. I am not religous by any means but certainly would like to see some competition in the education market place. And, while these people deride you for wanting the Judeo-christian God taught, my daughter had had to endure a plethora of politically correct BS including writing a paper on why the Muslims are more peaceful than Americans, and why the Revolutionary War was fought by Terrorists. that was the last straw and chose to pull her out out of these wretched people’s hands. She is in a Christian school now, where I am assured of the values that are being instilled. I had several excellent teachers in public schools, but I believe those days are over.

    • Peter, why do you keep ignoring people’s questions about Christianity and morality and Huckabee’s remarks and what Jesus would do? Is it because you don’t care? Or because you don’t know?

    • Peter there are plenty of schools that exist today that teach the Bible and are associated with Christian Churches. Want your children to attend one? Then open up your wallet and send them to one, just as you have done. That is your choice. what is not your choice is to take money out of the public coffers to create public schools that are in direct conflict with the law. School is for critical thinking and learning.

      Remember the law Peter? The Constitution? The rule of law upheld by the Supreme Court that says there is a separation between Church and State and no public funds will go to support any religious institution. Well that includes religion in schools.

      How about this Peter, we all agree you can have a school that teaches the Bible, right next door there will be one that teaches the Talmud and on the other side, right next door there will be one that teaches the Q’ran. How about that? Does that work for you?

      This is not, never has been and despite your obvious misguided belief otherwise, not a Christian Nation. Was not founded as such and was not intended to be.

      • Valentine – will have to take exception to your last statement. Perhaps you should reread (or read if that is the case) the documents constructed by our Founding Fathers. Are you trying to rewrite history which seems to be the fad nowadays?

    • Have you ever thought about how it would feel to be a Jewish child in public school having Christianity shoved down your throat? You don’t have to be an atheist to disagree with the teaching of Christ in a federally funded school. Just once, think as the minority, not as a bully.

  20. Thank you for this beautiful article, so well written and the sentiments are right on! I read some of the replies and as always am astounded at people’s take on things. Most are trolls who can somehow go totally off the mark and find even here a platform for their rhetoric. This is NOT about teacher’s unions!

  21. I find it odd that so many of the commenters here seem to miss the author’s entire point. She’s not saying that Huckabee is belittling or hating on teachers. She’s just pointing out that Huckabee is so concerned with fully endorsing the Christian faith (to the exclusion of all others), to notice how much good is being done. I think it’s a legitimate point, and even though I think Huckabee was just trying to answer the question, “Where was God,” with something that made sense to him, I’m still disappointed that he didn’t anticipate the total knock-down drag-out his remarks would instigate. As a Christian he should understand that evil happens because we’re all sinners and the whole world is fallen from grace. It has nothing to do with separation of church and state and for that matter, Adam Lanza had no connection with the school whatsoever. So I don’t know what Huckabee is talking about. Besides, evil happens everywhere, including the Church, the Amish community, etc., where God has not been relegated to the sidelines, so Huckabee’s logic is off. Just sayin’.

  22. Those mass-killings of innocent children happened because someone didn’t raise his/her kid right or perhaps didn’t get him medical help. I think that even such schools that aren’t managed well, don’t teach kids to kill. Often kids who see violence in their homes grow up to become criminals. Perhaps, it will be a lot better for all societies American or otherwise to look within and figure out what’s going wrong. Morality need not have a religious basis – the sense of right and wrong often goes awry when what children see at home doesn’t match up with what they learn at school.

    • As a retired school principal, I understand exactly what the letter writer was saying. Every day, for over thirty years, I saw teachers practice what Jesus preached even to childre of other faiths. Those who think that God is not in schools sure limits the power of God. The best teachers I ever observed practiced their faith; which is much more important than saying you believe. Mike Huckabee is way off base with his comment.

      • What about non-Christian teachers? Many who put their different faiths into practice do beautiful things for the world. Including those who eschew faith.

  23. I am 71 years old. Never once did we pray in school when I was a child, and I taught school for 37 years where we never prayed in the classroom. I was in the 4th or 5th grade when “under God” was inserted into the pledge of allegiance, and I think it is too bad that the person who wrote that pledge didn’t have it copyrighted.

  24. While I agree with so many things in this blog I think you have put words into Huckabee’s mouth. I would not agree with you saying he believes it happened b/c there is no God in schools, rather he is responding to the question so many have of “where was God”. These are two very different things. I am a religious woman and feel this would have happened no matter what because God gives you a choice of being good or evil. This was clearly evil. However, how can so many who have kicked God out of politics, schools, and just daily life ask him why he wasn’t there to help. We need God, we need prayer, we need to choose his path-that is all he is saying – in my opinion of course.

  25. I read the entire letter. Why are we taking the word Christmas Break and making it Winter Break? Why are we not saying the pledge of allegiance every morning as we once have done daily before school started collectively as one voice? Why are we not allowed to discipline children in schools? I am a Christian. I am not perfect. I sin. I make mistakes. I judge people. As a society we are so lost that everyone wants to blame everyone but themselves. We want to see OUR name in lights. We want to take credit for the great stuff, but blame for the bad. If you think Mike Huckabee is a bad guy for making a statement that you read, then so be it. If we dont see what this country has become by now, then we have NO hope. You may think you have the answer. But only half of the people you come in contact believe your ideas are right and I am giving you at least 20%. That is a 50%! F! I am not questioning your religion, you as a person, mom or any part of your character. I am questioning this entire country. We change the constitution everyday. Challenge it in a Federal Court. And they win! Wow! How sad. This Country was based on certain morals and values. As a society we have manipulated our neighbors into believing it needed to be changed. We changed it for what reason? We are afraid to work as hard as our ancestors did? I am sorry! This used to be a country that everyone was proud of. Now we have excuses for why we need to be better than proud? We have to make it easier for the lazy? I have news for you. We better change or you will find out what work is all about. Then who are you going to blame, blog about, or talk about? I made a difference tonight in my community. I am going to make a difference in our State and our Country. I am not going to sit behind some monitor voiceless. Whats that? You were going to do or say something? We were going to do it and saying it is old. You are part of the problem and are just like people who watch things happen. You then turn into the wondered what happen instead of making something happen. I want everyone to know that I am not attacking PTO mom. I am attacking us! WE have messed up. We took the easy way out, got comfortable, and now we are paying the price. Its bad people. Please open your eyes and notice what is going on. Your neighbors lock their doors all day, and pull their shades down. They avoid you. They dont stop and pick up your kids when it is raining out, because they are in a rush. Really? God help us all! I pray for a mass number of people to stand up and say enough already. Take the blame for once and make a difference.

    • Regardless of who said what, your statement is “right on.” It is the job of parents and religious institutions to teach prayer and spirituality. Teachers work tirelessly instilling learning while at the same time impletment spiritual teachings. The job of teacher does just that without any teacher setting out to “teach God or religion,” and their example in the school and community is in fact, instilling God in the school. Teachers demonstrate patience, steadfastness, honesty, truthfulness, humility, and on and on….all God’s virtues. Every day teachers practice “work as worship” and “fewness of words and abundance of deeds” as they instill learning and the love for learning in their students. So, God does live within the public schools, if one but notices.

  26. Jumping to conclusions about what Huckabee said doesn’t sit well. You put words and thoughts in his mouth. Please be careful about what you write, it is irresponsible to accuse someone of such a horrible thing. Rewatch the video, you won’t hear the things you are accusing him of.

    • Amen Marci….talk about being misconstrued…this writer did!! Never have the teachers been called union thugs….the thugs are the ones out there punching another citizen who is voicing their opinion just like the unions do…!! Please listen to that video again before you write such a non-factual reply!!

      • Norma J,

        Please learn about unions from a primary source instead of listening to all the unfair rhetoric on TV. The union bashing is coming from those who don’t want to give a livable wage to employees. My union was very fair. It negotiated in good faith with the administrators. It stood up for teachers who were being mistreated. It had to follow all the same laws as everyone else. It took cuts when there was nothing to negotiate. It took pay freezes when necessary.

        Unions are simply people working together in unity. One person cannot get much done, but together we are powerful. My union collected money for the poor; we collected and donated money to neighboring districts who were in financial straits; we collected food for the hungry and clothing for the poor; we donated blood for sick students; we became bone marrow donors for our students who had cancer.

        Making assumptions and repeating other people’s opinions just makes those doing it zombies. Get out and see for yourself what is going on in unions. Find out what working conditions the workers found unacceptable and fought to remedy. Find out what conditions negatively affected students and what the union did to change them. Find out what working together helped the workers accomplish.

        Unions are not the way they are portrayed in the media. Only the bad news gets reported because it sells.

        Pulling other people down to one’s level is not the answer to this problem. Instead, people should try to raise themselves up. Unions are made of people who are willing to work for better health benefits, better pay, and better working conditions. If people are jealous because some groups of people have better working conditions, maybe they need to start a union and fight for better conditions, too. Every perk that a union has was worked for, fought for, and negotiated for. Negotiation means the union had to give something up to get what it received. Negotiation is a give and take. Nobody gets everything, but the media and the people who have the money to utilize the airwaves would have people believe that.

      • Unlike some on here I don’t need to rerun his video. I understand exactly what he said. And I don’t need a bunch of talking heads telling me what I heard. If he wants people to understand what he has said hee needs to state it that way. Once it is put out there it is on the record. You Huckleberry protectors do no good spewing your opinions of what he said. He said what he said. If he looks like a inept, moronic, bigoted, blovinating horses ass then he should have engaged his pea sized brain before he put his mouth in gear.

    • But he did state that god was removed from the school. Don’t deny the facts. Huckabee is a Christ-O-Nazi. He uses his religon as a weapon!

  27. I have to say that there is nothing “godly” about teacher’s unions. They’re just a racket, like all unions, that suck money unnecessarily from the system. Public unions are the worst because the taxpayers don’t even get a seat at the negotiating table. Get rid of unions and then we can talk about how dedicated teachers are.

    That said, I agree with most of what PTA Mom says. Religion doesn’t belong in school. That’s the province of parents and whatever religious organizations they choose to join. No one has a right to foist their religion on anyone else. It’s definitely a door we don’t want to open. Look to the Middle East to see how well that idea works.

    • Without the unions we would not have the high quality of teaching that we do have today. The writer was not saying that religion does not belong is school, but that God is there in the work of the teachers. The teachers’ work is a God given gift.

      • Horse Hockey! If you remove the Unions, put the emphasis on teaching rather than paying someone to address Grievances you might accomplish something. You are a professional, with a degree. You are telling me you have pay someone to speak for you? That you cant speak for yourself? There are ways school boards can deal with public service works without the necessity of a Union. It is so stupid sheep following a wolf over a cliff…

    • Unions gave us the weekend. They gave us a 40 hour work week. They made it harder for unjust employers to threaten their employees when they called in sick. To make blanket statements about how bad unions are is to ignore all the good they have done for anyone what works for someone else. Have unions done things wrong, yes but that does not mean we need to get rid of them.

    • Dear Tula,

      You couldn’t be more wrong about unions. I have worked in unionized school districts and non-unionized school districts, and the teachers in both worked their hearts out for their students. We are teachers because we love to learn and we love to help others learn; we fall in love with our students; we bleed when they bleed; we cheer when they cheer.

      The union I belonged to was amazing. I think you would have been a part of it if you had worked with us. We worked hard to make sure our students were being serviced to the best of our ability. As any teacher will tell you, when class sizes rise over a certain number, the quality of teaching drops. It is simple math and simple common sense. When a couple has two children to care for between them, things are pretty under control. When they have three, things start to bet a little out of control. When they increase to four and five, the only saving grace is usually the oldest child helping out. Teacher to student ratios matter for the quality of teaching ans well as the sanity of the teacher. If you want good teachers to remain in the classroom, it makes sense to help them keep their sanity.

      In unionized school districts teachers have a more balanced life, but not by much. It has been my experience that teachers who have a union have more rights than a non-unionized teacher. I was told by an administrator that he didn’t have to give me a lunch; it was not a law. I didn’t believe him, but sadly, he was right. He did not have to give me a lunch. Interestingly, though, the same website that verified this, stated that people with unions usually had more rights than what was on the website.

      Unions negotiate. That means they give and they receive. We are not slaves. WE do not have to live in a society where only the powerful have power. To create a union is to balance the playing field. If we didn’t have unions in this country we would not have a middle class. Unions got blue-collar workers livable wages and working conditions that did not jeopardize their health or safety.

      Do the people at the top resent unions? You bet they do. Why? Because unions keep them honest. Unions make sure the people at the top come to the table and negotiate. Unions make sure the people at the top share the wealth instead of making record-breaking profits only for the people at the top. If all businesses were run like Ben & Jerry’s where the people at the top limit their profits and spread the rest among the employees, there would be no need for unions, but they don’t.

      • Eileen, you are one of the few people in these pages who show good sense and patience throughout their comments. You must be a very good teacher. Stay strong and don’t let the lesser voices rattle you.

    • If this is a free country, why not give parents the right to choose which schools their tax dollars support? Public school unions are thugs. We are all required by tax law to fund them. If teachers really cared about kids, they would ask the parents what they would like for their kids. And the answer would be simple, we want the right to choose. We want schools of all kinds competing for our tax dollars.

      • Because more than half the households in the US at any given moment don’t have school-aged children? Because in your working, taxpaying life, you also will only have school-aged children for a fraction of the years when you are paying taxes? School funding isn’t fee-for-service arrangement, It’s a public good. America led the way in providing free compulsory public education. It was a revolutionary idea that has changed the world. It makes our communities stronger. But it doesn’t pay for itself.

  28. Hello. Wanted to say that I was put off by your judging of motives in the first paragraph. Made it seem that you would welcome into schools anybody but Mike Huckabee, anybody but the God he’s referring to. You admit you’re cynical, and I’d agree with that. I was left with the overall impression that you only like the ideas you already agree with. It seems to me that school should be a place where all perspectives are welcomed, all are given the opportunity to be expressed — without being greeted by cynicism. Being cynical about other people’s motives usually results in a shutdown of communication, and that attitude usually is evident to the person on the other side, as it was here.

      • I did – read every word. (noted the use of “sanctimonious” near the end) The impression of being cynical and unaccepting of viewpoints different from the author’s own was present throughout.The whole idea of freedom is when confronted with someone who does not think the same to not push them aside. This post, in its entirely, did not give me the impression of being accepting of differing views.

      • Education only needs to learn “many views”….. of…learning to spell, read, write, add, subtract, work with others, play well with others,thinking for yourself and yes, computer skills. Parents are the ones to lead their children to God and choice of church…not the teachers J-O-B….!!!! I as a parent will take care of God’s teaching not my public school….Oh, yes, God is with me and our family everyday, sometime holding our hands and often carrying us…He is with us always…..even in tragedy…He is with us…!!!

    • Appears that you didn’t read the rest of the article, Justjoan. Wow. Could the short attention span and your inability to cognitively see the point PTA mom was making be accounted to your lack of imagination or your God-in-a-box?

      What frustrates me is the constant criticism of the unjustly monikered “Godless” public schools and teachers–many whom attend church (teachers and administrators and volunteers and school board members), believing in God’s saving grace through Jesus Christ, and actually live out their faith, day-to-day as PTA mom so eloquently demonstrated in her article.

      As if God can’t get into the public school without the aid of Mike Huckabee or any other politician for that matter…absurd. How about the non-existent mental health system or the Christian imperative to care for the ‘widow and the orphan’ that happens thanklessly in nearly every public school in the nation– teachers buying shoes, coats, hats, gloves– giving advice and comfort to single moms struggling with troubled children…story after story of love and care that doesn’t fit your godless story line or your political agenda.

      Jesus spoke in parables so the stories and illustrations of God’s love would be manifest in his people, not just paid lip-service. Read the article again, if you are able–and maybe some of the parables too– and witness God in Christ, incarnate in the (dare I say) faithful public school teacher, administrator and volunteer, sacrificially giving of their time, talents and gifts to serve the least and the lost, not just the privileged and the private.

      • Wow, Chris St. Clair certainly looks down at the rest of the low life’s who DARE to disagree with his/her massive EGOTISTICAL ATTITUDE. How refreshing, it is absolutely amazing that you and your fellow “educator’s” can not fathom why more and more of the “Ignorant Masses” are fed up with your constant whining, or your sanctimonious attitudes. Please, feel free to throw your pathetic barbs in my direction… I have a strong spine, and very thick skin, and you do not intimidate me whatsoever.

      • Just Joan,

        Was the teacher who told the child who was praying to stop errant? Yes, but please understand that teachers are cautioned so much about prayer in school that some are so frightened that they over react. The best thing to do in a case such as this is to educate the teacher. Most times, asking questions instead of making assumptions is the best route.

        As a Christian, I believe Christ suffered and died for us, but I was taught that talking about Christ is not as important as acting like Christ. As a public school teacher, I try to act like Christ as much as I can. That being said, I believe in freedom of religion. I am thrilled that I have the right to decide my religion, and I respect the rights of others to decide their religion.

        I have to say I am very cautious about bringing the Bible back into schools. The Bible onlys serves Christians. What about people who have used their freedom of religion to choose a different religion? Should they have to be forced to listen to Christian readings? Would Christians be content if we read equally from the lessons of all religions? Would they allow God to come back into our schools in the form of anything God but their God? I think not. Many would be highly offended and think we were trying to convert their children. From the rhetoric, it sounds like it is their way or the highway. This seems to go against our stance of freedom of religion.

        Our country is based on freedom of religion. I discuss this with my high school students. We discuss the difference between freedom of and freedom from religion. Even though I am Christian, I play devil’s advocate and always take the side of the non-Christian, so they see what it feels like to be in a society that is always forcing its religion on me. I ask them how they would feel if Muslims or Jews were the majority and they were forced to read about other religions daily not as a part of a comparative religion course but as a moral code with daily readings. Overwhelmingly, they say they would not want to have to do that.

        Interestingly, my students are curiously open when asked if they would accept daily readings from the Bible along with other religions. We also discuss what they learn in school and whether they can learn Christian values, which by the way are also Jewish and Islamic values, in school without reading Bible verses every morning. Overwhelmingly, they say yes, and are much more content about the state of things. They state on their own that they can get their religion at home, with their families, in their churches, and at youth group.

        Public schools are not the place to evangelize. There are plenty of other opportunities for that. We already have a hard time teaching all the other things that have been placed on us by those who are not willing to do it themselves: social skills, responsibility, self-respect, respect for others, character education, career skills, financial skills, etc. If students came to us with these skills already taken care of, we might actually be able to teach them the three Rs with more success. As it is, we spend an awful lot of time teaching kids what they should have learned at home. Religion goes right along with that. Parents are responsible for these things, and I believe they should remain a parent’s responsibility.

        Perhaps the burden falls on educators because we spend more time with children than anyone else. If that is so, then perhaps more parents need to spend more time with their children. If parents are not spending time with children, then it wouldn’t matter whether we read Bible verses in school or not. Children who are raising themselves are not going to benefit from them anyway.

    • I know in the past that teaching was a noble profession,but there is nothing noble about teachers of the year being downsized to save a half hearted union protected could care less about children deadbeat

      • The teachers aren’t being downsized because of the union. The teachers have taken cut after cut to their pay an benefits to KEEP working within the pittance of a budget that is given to the school systems today. I love the way people say that this country is going to hell with all the unemployment and the violence – but REFUSE to believe that a solid and GOOD education would more than likely solve the first problem completely and make a serious dent in the second. I am NOT a christian – I have a different faith, and “I” was the one who instilled the belief of deity in my children. Any teacher speaking to them of this Jesus guy would have been disrespecting our beliefs. YOUR freedom of religion is MY freedom from it. I don’t want your ideas to encroach on the beliefs of my family at all.

  29. If ever the divine spirit exists it is in the presence of our children. Children are not bereft of the divine. Too bad Mr Huckabee doesn’t see what is clear as day. You can pontificate religion all you want, but our country, our being was founded on separation of church and state and the freedom to worship without government intervention or tyranny.

    • Not so.The words separation of church and state were added some time later.The freedom of religion was to protect christians from a state sponsored religion such as the church of england an offshoot of the roman catholics

      • “Believing with you that religion is a matter which lies solely between Man & his God, that he owes account to none other for his faith or his worship, that the legitimate powers of government reach actions only, & not opinions, I contemplate with sovereign reverence that act of the whole American people which declared that their legislature should ‘make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof,’ thus building a wall of separation between Church and State.” That is a quote from Thomas Jefferson. The separation of church and state has been in the document from the first days of the bill of rights.

      • Randy, perhaps you are confusing that with when religion was inserted into the Pledge of Allegiance – That was not done until 1954.

    • Interesting that when this nation was founded, the Bible and Watt’s hymnal were the two most prominent school books, but now, that’s called tyranny. I won’t go so far as to say that keeping God in the schools would prevent something like what happened recently (something worse happened in Bath, MI in 1927), but I will say that teaching kids that we’re all just accidents trying to survive doesn’t really encourage the “golden rule.” It would seem to encourage people to do to others BEFORE they do to you… :(

      • Phil,

        The fact that the Bible and Watt’s hymnal were the two most prominent school books probably has more to do with the fact that books were rare and very expensive. We’ve had the printing press, Boston Latin, and public education to thank for the variety of books that entered public schools. The printing press because books could be mass produced, Boston Latin for being the first public school in America, and public schools for educating the masses and creating so many writers and readers of books.

        Saying that kids are being taught “that we’re all just accidents trying to survive” doesn’t even make sense. Where did you get that from? Your comment about the Golden Rule doesn’t make sense to me either. My children’s values and morals are solidified every day in their public school. It might not be called the 10 commandments, but it is there, it is discussed, and it is apparent. Public schools still teach morals and ethics because educators are smart enough to know how to do something creatively to get around obstacles. Public schools do what is best for the students and the community. They are not always successful, and sometimes they totally screw up, but overall, they are doing a great job.

        How many politicians went to public school? How many millionaires and billionaires went to public school? I didn’t go to public school. I earned a BA and a Master’s Degree. However, I can tell you my children in public schools are getting a much better education than I did. I think they will be much more successful than I in their careers, and as successful as I in life because I was the first person who taught them the Golden Rule. They live it every day at home, and it carries over into school. It shouldn’t be the other way around.

  30. I would say that anyone who is 45 and older probably grew up as i did. You learned that this is gods country, our forfathers came hear and built a nation on crristian beliefs and we where great, our country thrived,. I do understand the logical reasoning in todays thinkers that we have evolved into a multi cultual society and that everyone should be treated equally. taking the teachings of something as simple as the lords prayer from our schools has changed how our children think, when the morning bell rang the first thing you did was recite the lords prayer and it was something you did every day. The goodness in the words set the tone for the day and you grew up with the beliefs of those words, they where engrained in your life. It was that one simple thing, taken away because people want to over think everything until we covince ourselves we don’t need it or it isn’t fair. We then ask, why our children are confused and act out. but make no mistake. this is not the only reason,. discipline has also changed. swatting your kids butt imediately had them thinking twice about doing wrong. So it’s all the little changes adding up. but instead we want to run studies to find out why people do what they do, instead of sticking to what worked. Old fashion values and beliefs

    • With all due respect, there are a lot of secular communities outside the United States that never began mornings with a prayer and never had to nedure a school shooting either.

    • Republican base showing up it seems bringing their simple answers for complex questions. Education system flagging, unavailability of mental health resources, low funding…. and the solution is saying the Lord’s prayer every morning. Truly brilliant. Why can’t some people get it through their head that anyone who wants to pray before the school day begins is allowed to. The point is no teacher should be standing at the front of a classroom of young children and telling them they need to pray.

      • Absolutely agree, except for one thing: that is exactly what happens. My daughter pledges allegiance every morning to “one nation under God” despite my gentle reminders to her, and her teacher, that in fact she is not required to do so. She can sit quietly or stand respectfully but not say the words. Sadly, there is still that one tidbit of forced Christianity in the classroom. However, PTA Mom has all my support. She is right all the way. I may not call it “the presence of God,” but I know what she’s talking about. Anyone who has any sensitivity and sense of reality knows what she’s talking about. If anyone wants to see God at work in a school, or, if you’re like me and not religious, want to see the profound in human compassion, look at those teachers who died trying to save their charges. Those who respond to her heartfelt, sincere, and very realistic letter by slamming the unions and teachers are at best insensitive warts. Try being a teacher and see how much of a leech’s life it is. And try standing before a gunman knowing in one second you’re going to die a horrible death, as you tell him a lie to keep him away from your students. (No, I’m not a teacher).

    • You obviously do not know your history. The first settlers that inhabited America were Puritans (not Christian but Protestant). Of course, the true first religion of America was Native American…but we won’t go there. The Forefathers found this nation on Freedom (Thomas Jefferson was an ATHEIST). Freedom of Religion and Freedom from Oppression. It was NOT founded on Christianity. The Pledge of Alleigance was originally written without the phrase, “Under God” until the 50′s at which point it was added. This was because we can be united as one nation without all having to believe in God or one specific God.

      I think it is also foolish to think that people who send their kids to public school are “God haters” or “unreligious”. There are many religions within our borders and not all of them subscribe to the Christian way of believing. The schools are not “Godless” they are “Non-Denominational”. If you want to celebrate Christianity in the schools, then you must equally celebrate Kwanzaa, Hanukkah, Eid al-Adha, etc. But, if people want to pray to a Christian God or Catholic God and have their children taught according to those tenents, they will enroll their children in Christian or Catholic School. They enroll their children in public school because it is non-denominational…and it should be. Public school is the melting pot of many religions…and should not be conforming to any single religion.

      And it’s annoying to hear that my children are, apparently, Godless because they attend public school…or that I am teaching them “wrong” because we are not Christian. Shame on you (and Huckabee and others like you).

      • Ugh, speaking of not knowing one’s history… Thomas Jefferson was not an atheist, but a deist. He absolutely believed in a God… read the declaration of independence. And who said that people who sends their kids to public schools are “god-haters”? Who said that children in public schools are “godless”? My goodness the hyperbole of the left is annoying.

    • The Lord’s Prayer is entirely Judeo/Christian. I’m a buddhist who happens to have some theistic beliefs. If I were having kids recite something each morning, it would sound like this:

      Beings are numberless. I vow to free them.
      Delusions are inexhaustible. I vow to end them.
      Dharma gates are boundless. I vow to enter them.
      Buddha’s way is unsurpassable. I vow to become it.

      That’s the Bodhisattva Prayer in the Buddhist world. It’s encourages great compassion. Would you support your kids being required or peer-pressured into reciting that every morning? Why, or why not? I would never ask someone else’s children to do that. I would like all children to learn about compassion in school. It’s perhaps life’s greatest lesson and it makes living in this difficult world easier for everyone. But I would not want them to associate compassion with any one religion because compassion is a human value, one that can manifest itself in a myriad of ways. Isn’t there a way we can agree to that?

    • In my entire school experience, never once were we led in morning prayer. In my earliest years the pledge that we recited didn’t include “under God” either. We grew up just fine in a wild little town in Wyoming. No, not every school in America had prayer in schools. And for that I am thankful. I choose to worship in my own way, with my own family and of my own choosing, . . I am perfectly happy to have my son raised in the same manner where the predominant religion does not dictate what our teachers and students pray or believe.

    • I think you are oversimplifying things. I am your age, and I have to wonder if we grew up with what is in society today, would we have turned out the same? What did we not have? Internet, electronics, cell phones, mobile everything, fast food everywhere, few family dinners, divorce rates through the roof, child porn, child abuse, child molestation, etc. The list goes on and on. This problem is a very complex one.

  31. What I see in this well-crafted letter is a failure to discern between the works of human emotion and the presence/works of God.

    God has nothing to do with “religion,” as the world understands it. Education that is absent of the study of The Holy Bible is futile; it leads, ultimately, to loss.

    We don’t want God in our lives in this world; well, the absence of God in the next world is eternity in hell. That is the ultimate disservice to our children, and we will be held accountable–by God–for what we have done with His Son, Jesus, with regards to teaching our children to know Him personally as Savior. This “full education” can only be achieved through the inclusion of The Holy Bible in school curriculum.

    • That’s right… The Holy Bible should be included in school curriculum. So should the Koran. And The Tome of Cthulhu. And The Holy Parchment of Bingidy Bong.

      • Oh my, get real-it doesn’t belong in our public school curriculum. That’s what CHURCH is for or Sunday School, Bible Study, etc. Do those teachings in your own HOME if that’s important to you-or send your child to a private religious school of your faith of choice. Our educators are not pastors etc-and it’s not a one size fits all.

      • Molly, that was my point. I thought that would be evident at least by my inclusion of the almighty Bingidy Bong.

      • Why shouldn’t the Bible be studied? Religion aside, it is one of the oldest written books in the world. The Book of Psalms contains some of the earliest songs known to man. There is a lot of cultural and historical information that can be learned. And don’t say that religion is not studied in school. In my high school we had a Mythology class which studied Greek, Roman, and Norse Myths as well as some Native American and African. At one time in history, those were all considered religious writings, including the Iliad and the Odyssey!

    • Fedup; I don’t want my children learning ‘your’ version of God. I want them to learn about the God I believe in; who, counter to your assertion, only asks us to make people aware of Him; He does not condemn us for the lack of response on the part of others. Your brand of Christianity is repugnant to me and I don’t want my children learning it. I believe in the Jesus of love and inclusion, not the God of eternal damnation. I’m ‘fedup’ with the hatred that is spewed by FOX News and the right wing so-called Christians (I even cringe to call them that). I don’t want children anywhere near the kind of ‘full education’ about God that you and your ilk would try to force on them. And trust me, I know the Bible quite well; I’ve taught it for over twenty years. And I use my full name, not afake one.

    • And here-in lies the problem. You say God has nothing to do with “”religion”, as the world understands it.” I say God has little, if anything, to do with your bible or any other religious text. If you want to believe that the bible is “the word of God” because that’s what you’ve been told, that’s your right. But can you understand that there are millions of us out here who simply don’t believe that? If you choose to believe that that means the rest of us are going to hell, then so be it. But we will never agree to let you brainwash our children with your beliefs. This country was not simply founded on the principle of freedom OF religion. It was also founded on the principle of freedom FROM religion. You go right ahead and practice your beliefs, enforce those beliefs on your children (which I personally find appalling), pay money to support those beliefs, vote for politicians who agree with your beliefs, whatever. Just don’t try and shove your beliefs down the throats of other people’s children. And by the way, prayer is not “outlawed” in school, just like thinking about having sex is not outlawed in school. We simply ask people not to do it in public. If you believe your God has some sort of problem with that, that He would somehow countenance violence because people aren’t “allowed” to pray publicly, well, that’s just another of a long list of reasons why I don’t want anything to do with your version of God. He sounds like a narcissist to me.

      • Finally, a rational point of view! I’ve been asking for my freedom FROM religion rights for quite a while now! And little Billy and Susie ARE allowed to pray in public, and even in school! They just aren’t allowed to ask the teacher to force everyone else to pray too! I’m not anti-religion! I’m not trying to convince anyone that there is no god, I just don’t believe there is one! Why is that SO HARD for people to accept? Why must the religious right insist my non-belief = hatred? How can I possibly hate something that I don’t even believe exists in the first place? What I DO HATE is the cramming of others’ religious beliefs down MY throat. Or using THEIR beliefs to regulate MY life! Go, pray, attend church, sin, repent, sin again, but LEAVE ME ALONE! It’s not as if your belief is in any way diminished by my non-belief.

    • I appreciate your comment. When I grew up in the fifties it was unthinkable to not believe in the only Living God. The Bible tells us that we are all born with a God-conscience (the Living God being the Author) and that man will be without excuse.

    • You seem to assume that your God is the one true God. Is it not possible that God comes in many forms? There is so much literature out there that points to this. Explore beyond what you hear from the pulpit. Remember, it is much easier to control a brainwashed group than a group that asks lots of questions.

  32. I know you’re in Texas, but the schools you describe sound like the schools in Heaven.

    I have almost no use for Huckabee, but I have to say: Even allowing for a bit of rhetorical excess on your part, and stating for the record that I attended public school in a fairly prosperous place, your picture of public school and the people who worked there bears no resemblance to the public schools I attended or to the ones my children attended. In fact they were pretty much the opposite of what you describe.

  33. It is ironic, Kimberly, that you spent so much time berating Governor Huckabee and blindly accused him of speaking out before spending time in the public schools. You do realize that he was a governor at one time, so I suspect he did have at least a cursory understanding of public schools. But apparently you felt compelled and empowered by your keyboard to disrespect his intelligence, knowledge and public service, simply because he has a different opinion than you.

    I have to ask you: do you even talk to other parents at your school – including non-PTA parents? At other schools? Do you talk to parents who quit the public school for private ones? Or are you stuck in that dutiful PTA – drinking the public school Kool-Aid – land? DO YOU TALK TO THE KIDS? I mean, let’s get real here, the kids are the ones at stake. Be bold, go directly to the source. Ask my kid if God existed in his public school. I’ll be honest, I am less than impressed with Texas public schools – and it has nothing to do with strained resources, lack of funds, and the yadda yadda umpteen excuses that you listed in your letter. The picture you tried to paint of our public schools is riddled with delusions.

    I have a much different opinion than you, as the parent of a child FAILED by our public school system. I only have experience in the “exemplary” elementary schools, you know, the ones that are TEA-professed to be “the best.” I removed one of my children from this “exemplary” institution and he is now thriving in a private Christian school. It took him about half an hour to start thriving. He didn’t realize how dreadful his public school experience was until he learned there were other ways of being, other ways of teaching, other ways to foster friendships, other ways to resolve conflict, all of them Godly ways. The kid who fought me fiercely over removing him from public school, and vowed to do his very best to get kicked out of private school, now begs me to NEVER send him back to public school. He’s all of 10 years old and can see and feel this distinction with absolute clarity. My son would challenge you any day over your profession that in his public school “His presence and teachings are instead practiced, demonstrated, and felt.” Epic fail. EPIC FAIL. My younger child has been blessed with two angelic public school teachers, and he remains in said “exemplary” institution, but he’s only in first grade, there’s still plenty of time to fail him, too.

    HATE, MEAN, BULLYING, TEASING, INTOLERANT, HARSH, COLD, FAKE, APATHETIC, CONDESCENDING, MUST-FIT-IN-THE-BOX. These are all words that describe my 10-yr old child’s experience in his particular “exemplary” and godless public school. They describe collectively many of the administrators, teachers, students and their parents. You brought up “in loco parentis.” I have had both the blessings and severe misfortune of subjecting my children to the “in loco parentis” of the teachers and administrators in our public schools. I invite you to reconsider that children spend far more awakened time at the public school than in their own homes. On the one hand, this is great for absentee and detached parents, and they lean heavily on this wonderful feature of their right to public education to the fullest extent to raise their children, free daycare, if you will – and it works fabulously for them. For involved and supportive parents like me who find themselves misaligned morally and spiritually with their child’s teacher and administration, it is disastrous. The dichotomy cannot be more profound. It doesn’t take long before there is conflict between the godless and my child, or between them and me Their devoid of God is blatant in their actions, and encourages my child to believe it’s OK to act that way (see the HATE, MEAN, etc. words at the beginning of this paragraph). I spent precious time undoing the damage they inflicted on my child. I don’t want that form of “in loco parentis.” These godless “educators” and experiences exist in uncomfortably alarming numbers in our public schools.

    To say that “He” never left the public schools is the delusion you have magnificently created in your own mind and experiences, and then proceeded to spew out to the blogosphere. It is the story you concocted to puff up what you want it so desperately to be, not what it really is. Ask around, I challenge you to really do your homework and ask around, no – for real, ask around, and ask a cross-section of parents in your school, in other schools, in wealthier districts, in poorer districts. Talk to elementary parents, middle school parents, high school parents. Talk to parents who have chosen private school. Talk to those outside the state of Texas. TALK TO THE KIDS. Those who are brave enough to give you an honest answer will succinctly reveal your delusions. For me and my child, the difference is stark. The instant changes in my son are nothing short of phenomenal. But then, my God is nothing short of phenomenal.

    • So, I’m sorry…is this a “My God is better than Your God, so if you don’t believe in My God the way that I do, then you’re screwed” assertion?

      That’s a damn good argument…backed up by the experiences of your child. I know of just as many children in Christian schools who have experienced Bullying, hazing, and condescension. So what do you have to say about those schools?

      I find it strange that you are labeling children in all public schools as God-less…could your experience and your child’s experience be clouding your judgement, at all? Sounds to me, you need to be asking questions of the same.

      • Angel, when someone says to you “Oh MY God” do you ask the same?

        I have no knowledge about the particular Christian schools you speak of, and to comment on them would be speculative at best. Issues are handled very effectively in my son’s private school, this I know.

        So, I guess you missed the part where I stated my other son still attends public school. He is not godless, nor did I ever say that ALL children in ALL public schools are godless. When I say godless, I am referring to the stark secular environment.

        The main point of my post was that the OP bashed Gov. Huckabee for not doing his homework before making his assessment. Yet, she did the exact same thing. I was merely offering an alternative view, one that she apparently never sees in her public schools, and I challenged her to back up her assertions among a wide swath of public and private school America.

        Someone else commented here that OP was making Texas schools out to sound like heaven. Not surprising, coming from the wife of a public school elementary school principal. Yet curiously, you ask me if my judgment was clouded? I am not part of the public school administration (but I am a PTA member), nor do I receive or depend on ANY salary from the state of Texas. People won’t bite the hand that feeds them. Seriously, it’s not all kumbaya like Kimberly would have us believe.

    • Amen, Catherine. My reply (which I put in the wrong place) is written similarly to your. My experiences have been quite similar. I agree with you.

    • I understand the letter and agree with parts of it. Some do hold these feelings in their hearts – not necessarily most. These teacherd of SHE should be put on a pedestal for being the heroes they were to these children and families.

      To think that all teachers are this way is idyllic and naive. I have taught in public school and I have watched many children be ridiculed, harassed, and called names in the schools (of CT); not only by TEACHERS (who had never heard of the anti-bullying act!?!), but by ADMINISTRATORS (and I’m sure CT is not alone).

      I don’t think there needs to be hard-core religious teaching, necessarily in schools because people do have varying beliefs; but I don’t think holding a moment of silence for a person’s own purposes (prayer, vocabulary drill, song) is wrong. I also don’t believe it is right to have children, teachers, or anyone led to believe that God doesn’t belong here or there and that they should feel wrong in wanting a connection with Him. Unfortunately, whether public prayer occurs or not there is still free will and humans will commit evil on other humans. My own feeling is that there is comfort in knowing that God is welcome in all circumstance, so, though I don’t have to “impose Him” on others — I have the right to seek Him as I wish.

      I do recognize Mr. Huckabee’s comments as similar to my own in that God isn’t going to do what some wish and desert anyone, anywhere, at any time, regardless of their actual beliefs. That being said, in a country where mentioning Christmas is frowned upon, considered “right-wing extremist” or “unpatriotic” and is met with correction of “Happy Holidays” (sorry, I actually meant “MERRY CHRISTMAS, it’s what I said, but thank you), there is need for religious freedom rather than condemnation.

      God was there in Sandy Hook regardless of anyone’s beliefs. But, with constant consideration of being “politically correct,” not all recognize His presence or feel His peace. I believe a brief translation of Mr. Huckabee’s comments can be found in Proverbs 3:6: Acknowledge Him in all they ways and He shall direct your paths. SOME do behave in a good and Godly way — many, for some reason, do not. To believe it is all one way or the other is rather delusional. To think all teachers do what they do because they are all driven to do so by God rather than union is ludicrous; human nature generally plays a bigger roll than faith for many. This is obviously just my opinion. MERRY CHRISTMAS!!

  34. It never ceases to amaze me how LITTLE is generally known about God. But, since reading of The Holy Bible is not taught or practiced, people are left to either their own thoughts (God forbid), or the thoughts of someone else (even worse) on who God is and what He does. Read His Book and KNOW HIM.

    • I’m an atheist after having been brainwashed, into my 20′s, to believe in your fairy stories. One thing that woke me up was reading the bible. Any being as narcissistic and blood-thirsty as the god described in the bible either does not exist, or if it does, is not worthy of worship. So I would bet that I know the bible better than about 90% of the self-proclaimed christians.

      And it’s not just me — most atheists who were raised in religious households know the bible better than the True Believers (TM).

      But more to the point — no one took god out of schools. Kids are welcome to pray anytime they want. It’s just that no one is allowed to FORCE kids to pray. Why do so many theists have a problem with this?

      • The fact that you called Jehova “narcissistic and bloodthirsty” reveals how little you actually do understand the bible. People are often turned off by a God who sought justice in the Old Testament because they assume it was arbitrary. In actuality, God brought judgment upon people who were involved in such horrific acts as child sacrifice (among others). Furthermore, he gave plenty of warning to nations and people group to repent before enacting said justice. I for one, have no problem believing there is justice from a higher power. When there is such evil in this world, for instance like what happened in Newtown, I thank GOD he is just!

      • “Then one of them, which was a lawyer, asked him a question, tempting him, and saying, Master, which is the great commandment in the law? Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind. This is the first and great commandment. And the second is like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself. On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets.” – Jesus

        Absolutely agree. What a hateful and bloodthirsty statement to hang an entire religion on.

    • Would I be able to know him the same if I read the Quran/Koran or Torah? How about the Buddhist Sutras? Or do you mean that your God and belief is the only one right one?

      Yeah, that’s what I thought. You may be a good Christian, but a very closed-minded one at that.

  35. The fact that children are not forced to recite religious prayers in public schools is no more responsible for mass murder than shootings at churches are caused by the presence of prayers.

    • You are right, lack of prayer in schools is not responsible for school shootings or any other violence. However, it is a symptom of the sickness of our society. People usually die from a symptom of their illness (a diabetic can die of heart failure that is caused by the diabetes, their death certificate will note the cause of death as heart failure not diabetes) Our nation is dying slowly from our rejection of God

      • Are you for real? How about during the Crusades? When Christians were killing thousands of people for not believing in the Christian version of God?

        Our nation is dying, but not from a lack of God, but from an over prescription of psychtropic drugs which are used to “treat” mental issues…but only cause more issues, to which more drugs are used to counteract. Our nation is “dying” because we’ve allowed Big Business and Big Pharma to gain control over our lives.

        A rejection of God. Give me a break.

    • Jesus Christ IS God. Read in the Bible, the first chapter of the book of John, where is states: “In the beginning was the Word,…the Word was God…. The Word/God became flesh/a man and lived among us….”

  36. I believe that if Christians truly thought about Huckabee’s words they would not be so quick to agree with him. By stating that God has been removed from the public schools and “escorted out of our culture,” Huckabee implies that if only we “allowed God” back in, we would not experience this sort of tragedy. We all know that’s not true. The Christian message is that this world is fallen, broken by sin, and it’s been that way from the beginning. The Bible teaches that because of sin, there is evil in the world that must be contended with. Simple as that. But it’s also very clear that “every good gift is from God,” and, therefore, we can rejoice in the good and mourn the evil without pointing fingers or laying blame. Every one of us has sinned and fallen short of God’s glory, and it’s our Christian duty to understand that THAT is the reason for the tragedy and devastation and destruction and death experienced in the world. Humanity is responsible, not any one person, group, regulation, law, or policy. People sin. THAT’S the Christian message. But the good that happens in the public schools is certainly from God, and should not go unnoticed. That’s the only point the author is trying to make, and I agree with her. Huckabee’s message, however heartfelt, is misleading. We cannot eliminate the evil in the world by “bringing God back” into public schools. We cannot love, honor, or praise God into delivering us from the evil that fallen humanity has brought upon itself. He didn’t spare His own Son–Why should we be spared? But God hasn’t abandoned us. He is with us all the time. Even when we hate. Even when we err. Even when we are blinded by selfishness and obsessed with our own ambition. If that’s not so, He would not have sent Jesus to save us all when we were powerless in the grip of sin and death. The world hated God, but God overcame the world. I’m sure He can overcome the U.S. legislature, too.

  37. We cannot remove God, only He can do that. Thank you for this rational, well thought out response. I assure you God was there and with each and every child and educator.

    • God will not force Himself into our lives. If we tell Him to leave us alone, He will. This will NOT affect the LOVE He has for us–God is love, but will restrict His intervention or involvement in our lives.

      • Thank God your perception of God Fedup is NOT mine (and hopefully others!) The God you know is the God you will reflect and the God you reflect is not the God Jesus speaks so lovingly of and so faithfully about. And I have no doubt if Jesus walked on Earth today he would reject your frame of thoughts just like he did with the Pharisees and Sadducees. Jesus said we should KNOW God’s spirit, not his law. I’m just thankful I don’t live in your frame of mind. Hallelujah for that!!!

  38. Thank you for your brilliant and thoughtful response to his arrogance and ignorance. I believe deeply that we can teach Christian values (and indeed, the values of all the religions) without ever mentioning Christ (or Allah) in our schools. We do it be example. We do it by teaching compassion and empathy. We do it by teaching generosity of spirit and heart. Teachers do it every day by merely showing up. Thank you.

    • I just got done watching a video on YOUTUBE about Mike Huckabee’s response to these accusations (PLEASE watch here it will help clear some misconceptions up-http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hpMcM1JJR1M). I have not watched any other video except for this one, so I didn’t hear him dogging or undermining Christian teachers specifically (which is hard for me to believe he would do that). My response to this is more about how hard it is to freely allow the Holy Spirit to speak through us as Christian educators in Public Schools-pertaining to the last statement in the letter ..”You see, Mr. Huckabee, schools don’t need to preach the Gospel or read the Bible every day to bring God into the classroom. He never left.”

      Here are my convictions:

      I, as a Christian educator, have struggled with bringing my faith into the classroom. You hear most Christian educators say that “by there good deeds” they (the students) will see Christ; but how will the students KNOW it’s Christ in us if we don’t TELL them. I would have never been saved if I didn’t HEAR the gospel. Many unsaved people do “good” things… so what makes us different if we don’t say His name and share His good news? Once I step into a classroom, I am told not to speak of the name of Jesus. But because I am saved by the Lordship of Jesus Christ, it is no longer I who live but Christ who lives in me; I have to listen to the Holy Spirit if indeed He asks me to teach the children a Scripture, or play Christian music, or talk about salvation… for ” The fear of the Lord is the BEGINNING of Knowledge”. I believe there is no true, lasting knowledge apart from Christ Jesus.

      Proverbs 1:7 (Proverbs 1)
      The fear of the Lord is the beginning of knowledge;
      fools despise wisdom and instruction.

      So… the truth is, I agree that God is in the Public Schools because He is all-knowing and all-powerful and everywhere, even though some administrations and the government have done all in there power to SHUT Him out. However, let us be truthful as Christians, if we expressed our Love for Christ as our hearts desired, and obeyed the Holy Spirit’s promptings as often as we should, would we still have a job in the public school system? And if so, for how long? If we can’t speak His name, is He really invited, or even acknowledged? I believe that THIS was the basis of Mike Huckabee’s comment. And if that’s the basis, i believe he is right. I felt it this semester in the field… I’ve felt it in my university Career through some professors warning me about bringing religion in the classroom. We cannot deny the truth that the Fear of God has been taken out of school and replaced with man-made wisdom, which in and of itself is destructive. We cannot hide behind the LIE that we can share Christ without saying His name and His gospel – that we are all sinners in need of a Savior. I believe we hide behind this lie in order to make ourselves feel better. Here’s another video about the two camps of belief.

      • And what about children from Jewish, Muslim, or–gasp–agnostic or atheist families? You have NO right to proselytize in a public school. If you feel compelled to do that, then please resign and teach in a Christian school.

      • I agree with Editann. A public school is not a church. A Church is where children should be taught the faith. Since you are a Christian educator, continue to teach the children of people who practice your faith. Or go out and do evangelism work with your church. But I don’t want you teaching MY children and grandchildren your beliefs, because I don’t share them. I’m a Christian, but I strongly dislike the brand of religion that it is clear from your comments that you practice. We feel quite differently about what the Bible says and I don’t want you teaching them what I think are incorrect beliefs.

      • Lindsey, do you have any idea how condescending and judgmental you sound? Both you and Huckabee go straight to the “fear the lord” business, and I’m glad you can be that direct. Here is an alternate perspective. I believe that fear is the opposite of love, and no person or “God” is worthy of anyone’s worship if they require fear. I’m sorry that you and so very many of your kind believe that humanity is “naturally” sinful, and that we require “fear” of eternal damnation to live a good life. But hey, it’s a free country, so I will support your right to believe that, and even your right to push those beliefs on your kids (which I personally find abhorrent). But you want those beliefs pushed on other kids too. My children will be raised with love, and with awareness that there are unbalanced people in the world who will try to harm them (many of those under the guise of religion by the way). But I will not teach them to fear – and I will do everything in my power to make certain you are not allowed to either.

      • My children (who, like me, are not Christian) do not go to school to hear about your god. If they wish to hear about your god, they will go to church. They go to school to learn about such “un-Christian” things as Science and Critical Thinking.

        If you seriously think that your position should be little more than a bully pulpit from which to preach at students, then in my opinion you are not a teacher that should have a job in *any* public school system.

      • Lead by example. Religion and even belief in a deity isn’t required to be an upstanding moral person. If a person believe in Christian or other values, they should teach by the example of their behavior, not instruction from their religious text of choice.

  39. Thank you so much for this article It is spot-on! I am a teacher, and NOT a Christian. When I hear so much about God not being in the schools, the focus on printed words and window dressing saddens me. I see so many of my colleagues acting just the way the author above describes in their dedication to their students; I try, myself, to bring God into my practice through my caring and guidance of my students. As a Jew, I come from a background where teaching is considered a mitzvah… an act of faith and worship… an effort to heal the world. I don’t need to “preach” at my students, or post tenets of my particular belief in my class, to openly practice my faith through my daily behavior and to pass forward positive community values to the children. No, teachers do not need to talk about God in public schools. Actions are so much more important than words, and yes, God is very much already there.

  40. To the PTA mom;

    First of all, let me say that my wife is a teacher and I am a pastor. Beside being a pastor, I also am a substitute in a school district where security guards and metal detectors greet each student every morning. These security guards are equipped with side arms, mace, and even tazers. They are equipped this way, not because it is a part of their uniform, but it is because individuals have a low view of life. The Bible teaches, if you have read it, that all life is special.

    Let me further say, that these security guards are armed because many of the teachers do not have the authority to invoke Bible based discipline in the classroom. These teachers, who are Christians, are not allowed to discuss the issue of God to any of their students. They are allow to teach that homosexuality is a lifestyle that needs to be accepted as normal. They are allow to teach that evolution theory is fact and not a theory. They are allow to teach that all religons are the same. The reason why Christian educators are gagged on sharing their faith is because students can be easily swayed.

    I must agree with Gov Mike Huckabee, not because I am a pastor, but I see first hand the godlessness in the classroom. I must agree with Gov Huckabee because I hear the profane and profanity that comes out of the mouths of students, which is taught in the home, and I am not allow to exercise my right of free speech because the name of God, in a revenent way, is not permitted. I must agree with Gov Huckabee because the Bible, which in a less enlighten age was the centerpiece of the American education system, which the educational system produced great men and women of industry and other careers; but the Bible has been stripped from the classroom, and has been replaced with human sacularism manfesto, a godless view on humanity.

    Yes, PTA mom, you have a valid point that educators are treated as second and third class careers, but that is not because of the points you declared. They are treated as second and third class careers because God is no longer welcome through the front doors of school buildings, or around the dinner tables in many homes. Maybe, if we returned to the era where God was honored, our nation would see a healing, II Chron 7: 14.

    • Profanity taught at home sir – should not be used to discredit the work of teachers who cater to all cultures, religions, sexes, upbringings, and financial hardships. In a country as diverse as our own we should be thanking God that our teachers are able to communicate with so many different children while also teaching them an education that fulfills their needs to live a life in a DIVERSE country. Unless you also want teachers to cater to all the religious beliefs of all the students in the classroom please keep individual religious teachings out of our PUBLIC classroom.

      • so many things to say, as a gay parent of two remarkable, smart, funny, ambitious young adults, one of whom goes to a catholic university “despite” his background. So many things to say as the daughter of two educators, who raised 5 kids in a loving home, “despite” my dad being agnostic. My extended family includes two nephews in the military–one a disabled vet, home from Afghanistan–”despite” being raised in a low income, single parent household. I took care of my mother the last years of her life, including gaining the input of her priest, who welcomed me, “despite” my being an atheist. Do not insult or question the strength, loyalty, ambition, love and courage of my family.
        One more thing: if it IS historically accurate , the claim that we should return to being a Christian, bible-focused nation? In those “good old days” the same nation claimed slavery as a right, colonialism as a duty, class-ism as an accepted and necessary capitalist and cultural assumption…

      • Laura, I’m not going to argue with you, but I do think your view of American History is a little skewed. Much of what you are accusing America of being was actually European and not American. Yes, there was slavery, but it was never just accepted as a right. The most vocal abolitionists were christians, precisely because they believed God created everyone. The historical truth of the matter is that every time Christianity was introduced to a slave holding nation, slavery was eventually abolished. Even as far back as the 1st century A.D., Paul was telling slave masters to treat their slaves as equal brothers and sisters in Christ (book of Ephesians).

        Secondly, the US has never been a colonizing power like the European countries. The US NEVER went to another country, took it over, and forced it to become part of the US empire (like England, France, Germany, The Netherlands, Spain, etc. all did). Yes, the US did acquire some colonies (technically not a colony of US since our people did not go there to settle) as a result of the Spanish-American War, but local governments were set up and democracy was established were the people voted for their leaders. Most of those colonies were also voluntarily given sovereignty without any war or protest the like of which occurred in European colonies like India, Vietnam, South America, and even the US itself. Additionally, some of hose territories have chosen to remain a part of the US where the residents enjoy all the rights of citizenship.

        Finally, its a little hard to accuse a country of classism that has no nobility and celebrates those who achieve success and come from a poor background. Most of the early capitalists came from nothing. Rockefeller came from a family where his dad deserted the family and he had to drop out of school to get a job to support his family. Yet despite this, he went on to become the richest man who ever lived. Carnegie was the son of poor immigrants. Benjamin Franklin was a printer’s apprentice. There is no other country on earth where it is easier than the US to start with nothing and achieve success through your own hard work. Just look at all the actors, athletes and musicians. And regardless of how you may want to repaint history, this came about because of the Judeo-Christian values of equality, hard work, generosity, and freedom were present and celebrated in our country.

    • As a pastor, it is your responsibility to teach your flock to lead the children to the Lord. Surely you are not putting more resposibility on a government-run institution than you are on the parents in your church. You and your parents must put God in the children (and teachers). When the children go to school, God is there also. What happened in Newtown is because of evil in the world, not because you were not praying to prevent it.

      • God is in schools all of this world…Catholic Schools, Lutheran Schools, etc. Are those children living in less of a hateful world? No. This country was founded on the separation of church and state…this didn’t just happen yesterday.
        The lack of values are to blame here. Children learn values from their parents, and many of those values are attributed to religion. Without religion can you learn values? Of course you can. Without values can you have a functioning society? Not a very good one.

        Parents not parenting, and in turn not teaching values, has led us down a path of despair…not the lack of religion in schools. Children not knowing the value of life, and the value of the beautiful world around them, has brought us here. Those children grow up to uncaring adults, and they have children…and so goes the cycle.

        I work in Emergency Medicine. I witness the best and worst of humanity routinely. Do I value each of my patient’s lives because I learned about Jesus as a child? No. I value life because my parents led by example and taught me about how precious life is. I was taught to treat my elders with respect, help those in need, and put others before myself. Are these Christian values? Some would say they are, but I believe they are values of humanity.

    • God answered my prayers with President Obama’s re-election – and I thank the Lord every day that his faith represents the kind of faith that allows yours to exist – regardless of how misguided you are on supporting Huckabee, In my opinion, he is an opportunist and a poor example of a government leader that represents all Americans, regardless of whether or not they subscribe to his interpretation of faith. If a Hindu, Buddhist, or (gasp) a Muslim wrote Huckabee’s exact words, I doubt you would be as supportive.

      • You do not know that, you assume that. Know what they say about assume. It makes an ass out of you and me.

    • OMG!!! REALLY???? How many children just died a horrible and senseless death and you turn it into an argument about GOD? The death of these children and the PAIN of these families is such a crime against all humanity. If one child is in danger when they go to school then all children are in danger when they go to school. The bottom line is we live in a culture that embraces violence – it is all over T.V. it is in kids video killing games, violence is everywhere and no where do we see more violence on this earth than that which is done in the name of GOD!!! So you can keep your gods – all of them. Wouldn’t life be so much more pleasant if we taught children about PLEASURE instead of violence, but NO the church does not want us talking about pleasure…. how about if we taught children how to make love instead of how to make war…. take a look around you pastor, the world is full of haters and most of the haters are hating in the name of religion and GOD -

      • You can’t just go spouting off inaccurate statistics because they fit your needs… Let’s have a discussion about the Korean War, the Vietnam War, the War on Terror, WWII, WWI, were any of these done in the name of God? I don’t think so… So let’s go back further into history. The crusades you say? Excellent example. The crusades may have had the name of God slapped on the face, but if I go slaughter millions of people and say I’m doing it in the name of homosexuality, does that all of a sudden mean that homosexuals are to blame? Of course not! God had nothing to do with the crusades. A corrupt Catholic church caused the death of millions of people. Not God. Let’s look at your next point about “PLEASURE”. The problem with America is that we put so much emphasis on pleasure and self-indulgence that people no longer care for others. They care for themselves. Bottom line: What will me me feel best RIGHT NOW? What if, instead of teaching our children about pleasure, we teach them about loving their neighbor as much as they love themselves? Let me emphasize that point, because it often gets skimmed over and not really looked at. What if we, as parents, teachers, role models, taught our children that the value of all other lives are equally as important as the value of our own life? Hmm… Sounds like an interesting concept. Couldn’t possibly come from the “hateful” religion that is Christianity, could it? So please, believe what you wish. If you think religion is a hoax, you’re free to believe it! That’s the beauty of our country! But please, for the love of God, STOP spouting off hateful and inaccurate statistics because you have a misguided view of something.

    • Pastor, if you believe in Biblically based discipline, you follow all the laws of the OT and would advocate the closing of all Red Lobsters? Additionally, you , then, of course, ignore Jesus’ rejection of the sort of legalism that your post espouses at EVERY turn in his ministry. Clearly, you must side step the fact that Jesus freely associated and embraced the sexually immoral BEFORE they rejected any lifestyle or begged his forgiveness and corrected themselves.

      This sort of message makes me genuinely frightened about my faith because it removes God and trusts in the Law rather than the LIVING word. Pastor, does your Word Live? If so, and if we look at the long history of Christianity and God’s people, then to express such vitriol because teachers are “allow” to discuss tolerance towards difference and because they use their god-given brains to know the difference between a “theory” that is unknown and a scientific “Theory” that expresses a deeply shown trend in scientific terms.

      If you want to see what causes America to move away from Evangelical Christianity, I must ask you, “why do you look at the splinter in your brother’s eye, and not notice the beam which is in your own eye? How can you say to your brother, ‘Let me take the speck out of your eye,’ when all the time there is a plank in your own eye? You hypocrite, first take the plank out of your own eye, and then you will see clearly to remove the speck from your brother’s eye.” (Matt 7:3-5) Look in the mirror. Jesus knew people of faith like you, and he answered it clearly in the Bible…or do you focus only on the parts you like and rework the others to be meant for other people?

      • Dear Steve; Thank you for your comment. I thought hard and long before deciding to respond to your comment. After must prayer, I have come to three conclusions. The first conclusion is if I based my theology and doctrine on the OT, I would advocate the closure of all supermarkets and eating places that served pork or pork by-products, and not only Red Lobster. That would make me a hypocritic because I had a pork sandwich for lunch today. However, I do not. A Biblically based discipline style means we discipline in a way that produces a measure of learning. In short, if the discipline causes someone to consider the consequences of their actions before they act, they may not do it. “Time Outs” and reasoning styles have proven ineffective at best. Even Dr Spock and B.F. Skinner reconsidered their approaches to discipline styles at the end of their careers.

        The second conclusion is nowhere in Scripture does it say to come to Jesus, correct thyself first. Nor, did anyone that Jesus forgave never asked to be forgiven, they asked to be healed. Jesus did tell those he encounter to sin no more, and only one is mentioned who became a follower. The Bible does not teach to compromise the truth for modern dogma.

        The third conclusion is there has not been any sciencific proof that evolution has worked. 97% of pig’s blood is compatible with human blood. This must conclude we desend from pigs and not apes. There has never been no evidence of animals becoming another animal, and after millions of years, evolution has not continued. Where is the half ape-half man? Where is the half frog-half dog? Why has not man evolued into something greater?

        I hope that you will ask Jesus into your heart, and if you have, that is great.

        Thank you
        Gary

    • I find it profoundly disrespectful and lacking in humility when people advocate forcing children to practice their personal faith in public schools. You behave as if the faith of other people means nothing. It is disrespectful to the children and to their parents. It creates a feeling of exclusion, promotes confusion and encourages low self-esteem in people who do not believe exactly as you do.. I would much rather see this mother’s form of godliness is our schools than see the callousness of blatant disregard for the feelings and beliefs of others.

      • If you want to compel children to Christianity, then compel them through your love and compassion, not by force. That is the only true way to change hearts.

    • Answer a question for me Mr. Pastor. If there is a God, and he sent is only son, who is also God (not sure how you send your son when there supposedly is only one God) but anyway, if it is so important that all people must accept Jesus Christ as their Lord and Savoir, why did he only appear in one tiny area of the world? Orientals, American Indians, Europeans, most Africans, Australians, none of these people needed to have any interaction or knowledge of Jesus Christ? God couldn’t figure out that he should send his son to all people so all people would know Jesus?

      And don’t wimp out that none of us can know why God does things the way he does. Come up with a sensible logical answer. Then come up with a sensible logical answer why a LOVING GOD would allow a crazy person to slaughter innocent little children. Again, don’t say we have free will and the crazy guy used his free will. If he’s crazy, he’s not using any rational thought process, he’s not exercising free will, and God could have/should have prevented the slaughter.

      • The answers you seek will not come from a reply in 200 words or less. I think you’ve asked some great questions, and that many people are also asking the same questions. My advice to you is that if you really want answers to your questions, go visit with a pastor at a local church and ask your questions. Then, have a conversation where you are just as willing to listen and consider the answers you hear, as you are to honestly speak from your heart. Answers can flow from honest, respectful, and reflective conversations, not from emotionally charged rhetoric.
        If you are a reader, you may also begin to find some answers from the books “The Case for Faith”, “The Case for Christ”, and “The Case for a Creator”, all written by Lee Stroebel. These books are written from an investigative journalist (formerly an athiest) perspective, who asked the same questions you’ve just posed, plus a whole lot more, to people who have the theological, philosophical, and scientific credentials to provide factual answers that address these questions head-on. These questions that you’ve posed are worthy of a more thoughtful discussion that a response to an online article can provide – but rest assured, there are answers. The real question is, are YOU willing to consider the possibilities of where the answers will lead?

      • Mr. Ed, i don’t know where you got that God and Jesus are the same people because there not. They are two totaly different people and it tell’s you that in the Bible. God created man in his own image. Jesus was sent to earth to die for our sacrifice so that we can be forgiven for our sin’s it also say’s that in the bible. God dosen’t just let things happen and you can’t sit here and say that he allowed those innocent people to get hurt and die. He did not tell that young man to put that gun in his hand and go and kill them. Some people do the devils work as well. When a drunk man get’s behind a wheel of a car and kill’s someone while driving do you blame the man for being so selfish as to get behind the wheel of a car and drive or do you blame God because he allowed that man to get behind the wheel of that car and drive. Sounds kind of silly right? Every man and women is responsible for there own action weather it be with God’s or whoever you worship’s help or not. To sit here and say that he allowed those children to be killed is silly when clearly he was there. Teacher’s and principal’s threw thereself in front of him trying to get him to stop they were putting block’s up every way they could think, there was even one little girl that was the only one that made it out of her class alive all because of the fact that she played dead. Everyone has there own opinion and it is our job as adult’s to respect one another’s opinion wether we agree or not. Now i’m not saying let’s cram religion down people’s throat but it would be nice to bring back the pledge of Allegiance, and National Anthem. We listen to them when we go to a ball game of some sort so what’s wrong with it being in school’s? That was taken out of school’s and there was nothing wrong with them oh wait in most of you’r eye’s there was it had In One Nation Under God in it.

      • Thank you Ed for your comments. Let me first respond to your comment by saying, when God created the world, he created the world perfectly. When man rebelled against God’s Word, sin entered into the world. Because of this rebellion, you and I have inherited the consequences of sin. We can choose to live in a rebellious state, or we can accept God’s provision for our sin problem, that is Jesus Christ.

        This brings me to the second part of your comment. Jesus, God’s only son, is the second part of the Godhead. Jesus was with God when he created the world, and he is God, (John 1: 1). Jesus stepped out of Glory to a people that God chose to be his people. This is why Jesus came to the nation of Israel. After Jesus was crucified for our sin and was raised from the dead, his followers were commissioned to go into all the world to share the Good News of Jesus Christ.

        This brings us to the third part of your comment, why. The easy answer is to say no one knows the why God does what he chooses to do. I guess from your comment, that has always been the answer you got when you asked that question. However, here is the answer no one wants to hear. God is always at work to bring you and I to himself. This young man who walked into Sandy Hook Elementary school last Friday, did so as an agent of evil. John 10: 10, Jesus said that the thief comes to steal, kill, and destroy. As an agent of evil, he stole the lives of 20 children. As a agent of evil, he killed them, and destroyed many more lives with his actions. The verse does not stop there. Jesus went on to say He has come to give life and give it abundantly.

        There is no doubt in my mind that all 20 children are safe in the arms of God. If the adults gave their hearts to Jesus before last Friday, they too are safe in the arms of God. The question for you is this, have you given your heart to Jesus Christ?

        As long as there is sin in the world, agents of evil will always choose to kill, steal, and destroy. Until Jesus comes for his Church, Christians need to share what Jesus has done in their lives.

        God bless
        Gary

      • Angela, you wrote: “God created man in his own image” and “God dosen’t just let things happen”, and “… when clearly he [god] was there”. Please provide evidence to support your assertion. And I’ll even give you a hint to save you some time: a passage in the bible is not evidence.

        Regarding the national anthem, do you know its history? Do you know where the “under God” part came from?

      • I am smarter then what you think sir. Here are the answer’s that you have asked i have even went a step further and broke down the Pledge of Allegiance.
        “I pledge allegiance” (I promise to be true)
        “to the flag” (to the symbol of our country)
        “of the United States of America” (each state that has joined to make our country)
        “and to the Republic” (a republic is a country where the people choose others to make laws for them — the government is “of, by and for” the people)
        “for which it stands,” (the flag means the country)
        “one nation” (a single country)
        “under God,” (the people believe in a supreme being)
        “indivisible,” (the country cannot be split into parts)
        “with Liberty and Justice” (with freedom and fairness)
        “for all.” (for each person in the country…you and me!)

        The pledge says you are promising to be true to the United States of America!

        The original Pledge of Allegiance was written by Francis Bellamy. It was first given wide publicity through the official program of the National Public Schools Celebration of Columbus Day, which was printed in The Youth’s Companion of September 8, 1892, and at the same time sent out in leaflet form to schools throughout the country. School children first recited the Pledge of Allegiance this way:

        “I pledge allegiance to my Flag and to the Republic for which it stands one Nation indivisible, with Liberty and Justice for all.”
        “The flag of the United States” replaced the words “my Flag” in 1923 because some foreign-born people might have in mind the flag of the country of their birth instead of the United States flag. A year later, “of America” was added after “United States.”

        No form of the Pledge received official recognition by Congress until June 22, 1942, when the Pledge was formally included in the U.S. Flag Code. The official name of The Pledge of Allegiance was adopted in 1945. The last change in language came on Flag Day 1954, when Congress passed a law, which added the words “under God” after “one nation.”

        Originally, the pledge was said with the right hand in the so-called “Bellamy Salute,” with the right hand resting first outward from the chest, then the arm extending out from the body. Once Hitler came to power in Europe, some Americans were concerned that this position of the arm and hand resembled the Nazi or Fascist salute. In 1942 Congress also established the current practice of rendering the pledge with the right hand over the heart.

        The Flag Code specifies that any future changes to the pledge would have to be with the consent of the President.

        On June 14, 1777, in order to establish an official flag for the new nation, the Continental Congress passed the first Flag Act: “Resolved, That the flag of the United States be made of thirteen stripes, alternate red and white; that the union be thirteen stars, white in a blue field, representing a new Constellation.”

        I do not know what your religion and i am clearly not here to force it apon you. God is not someone that you can see but clearly something that you believe in, in your heart noone has ever laied there eye’s on God not even Jesus. I also believe that he dose exist, someone had to create this earth and the things that are on it, it didn’t just creat it’s self and if we evolved from gorillas like science say’s then why arent we still evolving why does it take a man and a women to have a child and why can’t a gorilla have a baby for people who can’t? To answer your other question about God being there well it’s clear that he used the teacher’s to shelter the children he also helped keep them calm and collective and to think with an open mind and react in suck a way that they did. Because you are wanting more evidence then just a passage from the Bible well i’m afraid that’s something that i can not give you until you have faith. I sir do not have all the answers for I am still young and still learning things myself and often find myself questioning God. If i had all of the reason’s or answer’s to all of the question’s well then maybe i could enlighten the world and teach a thing or to, but that’s just it sir i don’t. I hope this has helped you if not i’m still here and hope to find the answer that you seek.

    • Gary, I believe that if you truly thought about Huckabee’s words you would not be so quick to agree with him. The implication of Huckabee’s message is that if we all put God first in our lives He would rescue us from any and all evil and suffering. That’s not what Jesus taught, and it’s not what He experienced. The Christian message is that this world is fallen, and that as such, there is evil in the world that must be contended with. It has nothing to do with God, but the bible teaches us that every good gift is from Him, and therefore, we can rejoice in the good and mourn the evil without trying to point fingers or lay blame. The good that happens in the public schools is of God and from God, and should not go unnoticed. And Huckabee’s message, however heartfelt, is false teaching that deliberately misleading. We cannot eliminate the evil in the world. We cannot love, honor, or praise God into delivering us from the evil that fallen humanity has brought upon itself. God hasn’t abandoned us. He is with us all the time. Even when we hate. Even when we err. Even when we are blinded by selfishness and obsessed with our own ambition. If that’s not so, He would not have sent Jesus to save us all when we were powerless in the grip of sin. The world hated God, but God overcame the world. I’m sure He can overcome the U.S. legislature.

      • To Pink Parasol; If you would look at the Lord’s prayer, Jesus said to pray that God the Father to deliver us from evil. You seem to have an idea that God is unable to deliver his people from evil. How sad that you would believe that.

      • So are you saying you DO believe that anyone who prays for deliverance will never endure suffering or tragedy?? I think you are being dishonest with yourself if you hold to that belief. I know that Hod has the power to do ALL things. I also know that He sometimes allows evil to happen. Not because He wants it, but because humanity has brought evil into the world and must deal with the consequences. Jesus prayed for God to rescue him, but God didn’t. All of the apostles (except for John) died horrible, gruesome deaths. They prayed and did God’s work, but they were all killed. God chose to allow it. I don’t know why, but I know He is good all the time, and that He loves us dearly. That doesn’t mean we don’t have to contend with the consequences of the evil and corruption WE brought into the world. God allows evil to happen because the world is broken by sin. Not because of the public schools or the government or any other group or institution. If you don’t know that, with all due respect I think you are not really understanding the Christian message.

      • Dear Pink Parasol; If I believed that Christians will never suffer, then I would be mistaken. However, why would Jesus tell his disciples to pray for God to deliver them from evil? If we step into eternity, are we not delivered from evil? We do not cause evil to happen, Satan has.

        Yes, Jesus did pray for this cup to pass, but not his will but God’s will be done. The Christian Message is simple; share your faith with others. Tell the Good News of Jesus Christ, and nothing less.

        Oh, by the way, there were 2 disciples that were not martyed, John, who was exile, and Matthais.

      • But that’s ridiculous. The whole point of Huckabee’s remarks was that violence occurs in the public schools because God has been pushed out. But you and I both know that violence happens in Christian schools, churches, the Amish community, and other places in which God’s name is continually praised. Violence happens everywhere, because Adam and Eve sinned and corrupted all humanity, and the world has been corrupted ever since. Everyone knows this. It is a given in Christian Scripture, history, and tradition. (And btw, when I said the apostles, I was referring to the twelve that Jesus appointed.)

      • The idea that “We do not cause evil to happen, Satan has,” as you suggest, is unbiblical and un-Christian. The Bible teaches that “sin entered the world through one man (Adam)” and that “all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God.” Of course we cause evil to happen. To suggest otherwise is just preposterous. Moreover, you claim to agree with Huckabee that violence in the public schools is the result of the “systematic removal of God from public schools,” but you keep avoiding the issue of violence in Christian schools, communities, churches, etc. You also contradict yourself and Huckabee with your logic, because if you believe God’s permitting evil to befall Jesus and His disciples (despite their unwavering devotion to Him) was an act of “delivering them” from evil, it must follow that His permitting the Sandy Hook victims to die could also have been an act of mercy. (In which case, the evil perpetrated cannot be blamed on an absence of or separation from God.)

      • Gary, I’ve been reading this exchange. I think you are in way over your head with Pink Parasol and Listener. Maybe you should go back to seminary for a few refresheners in Bible and in critical thinking.

    • You have it exactly wrong: “A godless view on humanity” is what will SAVE the world. I’m sorry that you’ve wasted the solitary life you have dedicating it to a man-made god who does not exist.

      Save your sanctimony for the church, our public schools don’t need your message (which you conveniently sanitize of all of the Bible’s atrocities). More evil has been perpetrated in God’s name than has been averted; history is clear.

      Hopefully, Christianity, Islam, and all of the other anti-intellectual falderal will be history soon as well.

    • Gary,
      With all due respect, please re-read the article. The author states that teachers are ACTING out the Word of God and the teachings of the Bible through their actions on a minute-by-minute basis.every single day. She states: “God’s presence and the teachings of Jesus Christ are well represented by the works of the people in those buildings.” and “His presence and teachings are instead practiced, demonstrated, and felt.”

      With all due respect, sir, both you and Mike Huckabee sound dangerously similar to the spokewoman of the Westboro “church”.

    • Dear Pastor Gary,

      I am a Bible teacher in a public school (yes, we exist). I read from Scripture daily and have more freedom than most to impart Biblical values in a completely legal way. My program has been in place for 60 years and is a well respected establishment in our community.

      My school system has 80% poverty, full time armed police officers, and just as many problems as anywhere else. These problems come from home…not from school. My argument is that we shouldn’t worry about trying to get God back in schools as much as we should be worrying about trying to get God back in homes.

      You may not know this but the ACLU completely defends the rights of students to pray individually or in groups, read their Bibles in school, and participate in religious clubs and organizations. Maybe we need more parents to teach Christian values and principles at home and encourage their children to act upon them at school.

      • kd you are totally right on. I am a secretary in a high school and I’m not sure of the poverty rate but it is high. Our students have a long tradition now of praying before school out in the court yard, participating in See You at the Pole, FCA, and a Christian club called First Priority. We have seen students saved at school, ask other friends to pray for them and if a student were to read their Bible and share with friends no one criticizes or is judgmental of what they are doing. We have problems, fights, bullying etc that goes on but we also have students that care and will try and be a positive influence when these things happen. The lack of moral values,character and being respectful to others begins at home. Most of the kids I see that have problems and are so disrespectful, shout profanities at every adult that comes in their path have very low self esteem and when you meet their parents it’s evident who they l get it from. I am thankful for a school that allows students the freedom to pray, read their Bible and share Jesus if that is part of their life. When you take a way someones ability to say Jesus’ name, then you are taking away their freedom of who they are. What I have seen is that Christianity is the only religion that has been assigned a Do Not
        Speak sign. Other religions have free rein what they are allowed to do. It’s sad that this country was founded on Christian beliefs and values and we can’t recognize this to be the cornerstone that has brought all the other cultures and religious beliefs to be our a part of our American heritage.

    • Pastor Gary, you really don’t get it: it’s not: “The reason why Christian educators are gagged on sharing their faith is because students can be easily swayed.” Not at all.

      It’s about the separation of church and state. School attendance is mandated for children aged 6-16, and public schools are the means by which our nation makes that mandatory schooling available to all. Religious teachings do not belong in the public schools, they belong in church, in the home, or in private schools.

    • Too the PTA MOM,
      I must also agree with Governor Huckabee. I was an educator for 31 years. God was systematically removed from our school. We could not sing Christmas songs at the “HOLIDAY PROGRAM.” We could not do Christmas decorations. We could not utter the name of God or Jesus. I was even asked by one parent to remove the cross I wear around my neck. I refused. You must understand that we have let a precious few take away the rights of many. We have lost our way and need to find it again! We must respect one another but Christmas is about the Christ child. No matter what you believe. He is the Reason for the Season.

      • The precious few take away the rights of many? Oh my goodness! Did they forbid you to attend your church on Sunday? Did they tell you that you were not allowed to pray in your own home? Or are you upset that these parents do not want you touting your Christian beliefs on their children who may be Muslim, Jewish, etc? Or even a atheist? This country was not founded on Christian beliefs. This country was founded on Freedom of Religion…and if you are going to expect that you can tout your Christian beliefs, you must also be ready to agree with someone touting their religious beliefs.

        If you want to pass on your love of your belief of your version of your religion, then please go find a private school in which you can do so without a problem. However, in a school in which people of many faiths attend, don’t expect a warm welcome. Thus endeth the lesson.

    • Gary, how amazing it must be to be so powerful and knowledgeable that you are sure you know, not only what you need to do but what everyone else should do as well. But it must be exhausting to carry such responsibility.

    • Respectfully, I would like to suggest that perhaps you missed the point of the article. The author is suggesting that no particular religion needs to be touted in the public school system for God to be present. He is there in the efforts of students and teachers, the efforts put forth to improve the lives of children, often in the face of much adversity.
      These children whom you mention, who are profane in your classroom, probably did learn it at home. But the solution is not to invoke your religion, but rather to lead by example. I feel that’s what Jesus would have done. (There are other reasons why using profanity would be inappropriate, other than it profaning your god, whom these children may not necessarily believe. For instance, the sake of professionalism and respect that a student might want to gain is compromised if no one is listening to their thoughts when those thoughts are buried in profanity.)
      This nation is not a nation of one religion, or one belief system. That’s part of the reason it was founded in the first place. While I believe that everyone’s lives benefit from spirituality and a belief in something greater than oneself, I do not believe that the way in which I worship God is more correct inherently than the way in which someone else does. There is a separation of church and state for precisely this reason.
      I appreciate that you want to see God as more of a presence in young people’s lives. I think that’s admirable. But I also think that the compassionate, Christian way to consider it is that everyone must find their own way to God. (You can lead a horse to water, after all…) You can make the path easier to find and follow by leading your own life in a Christian way, but a public school is an inappropriate pulpit, for a number of reasons.
      I hope you can see that I agree with you, fundamentally. I think you SHOULD encourage students to take a higher view of life, and treat their lives as precious commodities, and their decisions with those lives as momentous. I also believe you can bring God into their lives without ever invoking His name. He is present, as the author of this post originally intended, without anyone needing to preach.

      God bless you.

    • I am a Christian who disagrees with you. I would not want the children in my lives to learn YOUR version of the Bible. Just because you call yourself a Pastor doesn’t carry any weight with me because I think you misunderstand and misinterpret the words of our Lord. In that ‘golden era’ of time you refer to, our nation also thought it was okay to own people as slaves and later to treat people with differently colored skin as less worthy people. And some of the worst profanity I have ever heard has come out of the mouths of so-called Christians telling me what an idiot I am to support the ban on assault weapons. I’ll teach the children in my lives what I believe in. At my church.

    • Gaaaaahhhhhhh…..Gary, you sound like you believe the earth is 6000 years old and that fossils were laid down in the biblical flood. Evolution is a process; it is accepted fact in mainstream science…surely if you are a substitute teacher, you must be well aware that the word “theory” as used in science is different from every day usage. Scientific “theory” is a collection of observations that explains an aspect of the natural world. Evolution is as real as the fact that the earth orbits the sun, or that matter is composed of atoms. You are just promoting your bible-thumping ideas here; I don’t want to see science education dumbed down in ANY school, public or Christian, because of literal bible believers.

    • So I suppose you don’t have a problem with an imam working as a substitute teacher and teaching his version of God to your children? Sorry, sir, but anything that is funded by tax dollars cannot be used to preach religion of *any* sort. If you want to teach your values, do so in church or start a community center to teach those children after school.

      FYI, there is far more ewvidence for evolution than there is for magic fairy dust or whatever else you believe. Additionally, there is homosexuality throughout the animal kingdom, not just in humans, so that kind of puts a crimp in your belief that it’s all about choice. And even if it were a choice, so what? What business is it of yours, the government’s, or anyone else what two people do in private or how they choose to commit to one another.

      Any god I would choose to believe is would not disparage love, even if it came in a form that some disliked. It wasn’t that long ago that interracial relationships were also viewed as negative. I doubt any enlightened person these days would argue for that now.

    • Very well said Pastor. I can not understand why a nation as great as ours has been. Can not see and realize how we are in a downward spiral since the decision to remove God from the education of our children.

      • This nation was founded on freedom of religion. It wasn’t founded ON religion. Read any of the writings of Jefferson or Madison, let them tell you what they thought about the differences between governing and worship. Jefferson had the UTMOST respect for ALL religions. He specifically speaks of the christian, muslim and jew in SEVERAL of his letters. Maybe if you bothered to educate yourself about the beginning of the country instead of drinking the fox juice you would have a clue what this “great” nation was based on. Also? This GREAT nation wiped out a whole people by systematically slaughtering the American Indian, who by the way had a religion of their own. Your defending the beginnings of this nation, founded in slaughter is a typical christian response. The christians are responsible for the biggest slaughter of human in history.

    • I just want to point out the irony in something you said here. You think evolution shouldn’t be taught because it’s only a “theory” but think Christianity should be taught….because it’s somehow more provable than evolution?

    • Posts like yours prove the importance of keeping religious indoctrination out of public education. If parents want their children to learn religious teachings, there are churches readily available for that very purpose. This way, parents can choose the exact brand of religion, with which to burden their children.

      Let’s be clear. Teachers and students are certainly allowed to pray anywhere, anytime, as long as they don’t force it on others. This prohibition on God is a fallacy created by the extreme right to make them appear persecuted.

      Pastor, you insult your God when you say he has been removed from the schools. Most religions teach that God is omnipotent and omnipresent.

    • Please see my above comment about school not being a bully pulpit from which to bludgeon students with stories of a murderous bully of a god who is so petty and infantile that he tells people “love me or else!”

      • Dear heathen in NC; Your name spells what you do not believe. The only comment I have for you is this: One day every knee will bow and Every knee will confess Jesus as Lord. For those who choose not to believe, they will bow before Jesus as their conqueror. As a conquered enemy of God, they will experience the full measure of God’s wrath. Believe it or not, it is your choice. I cannot leave you without telling you that today you have an opportunity to receive or to reject Jesus Christ.

      • Gary, I WAS a Christian. I ran screaming from it years ago, specifically because of people like you and because–unlike you, apparently–I actually read the Bible and saw Christianity for the abusive relationship that it truly is. The god that you claim is “loving” is a childish bully who can only get and keep worshippers through threats and intimidation.

        Try again.

    • Gary, I’m a little confused. If we “returned to the era where [sic] God was honored”, would that be the era when the whites tried to exterminate the Indians as “less than human”, or would it be the era when whites kidnapped blacks in Africa and brought them here to be sold into slavery, or would it be the era when thousands of “Christians” for every Christian abolitionist took up arms against the United States in order to preserve the institution of slavery, or would it be the era when women were not allowed to vote, or would it be the era when blacks were tortured and lynched because some white person claimed they were looking the wrong way at whites, or would it be the era when robber barons got off scot-free after hiring thugs to beat up and kill labor organizers, or would it be the era when the federal government rounded up thousands of citizens of Japanese heritage and put them in concentration camps, or would it be the era when bishops received reports of priest sexually abusing children in their parishes and simply transferred them to another parish so the Church would not be embarrassed? Please explain to me which was “the era where God was honored”, because it seems to me like all through our history, large numbers of Christians were in the forefront of activities that didn’t honor God at all.

      The main point, though, is that you do not have the right to use public schools to teach children your concept of God. Now isn’t that simple?

      • Understand your history correctly. Africans kiddnapped Africans to sell them to slave traders. Also, if you are going to play the tolerate card, be politically correct. They were Native Americans, and they were being gathered up not exterminated.

      • Gary, I am satisfied that I understand history at least as well as you do. Yes, “Africans kiddnapped [sic] Africans to sell them to slave traders”; but the trade really flourished when the African kidnappers realized there was a ready market with the European and American ships (delivering the slaves to the US and the Caribbean). And the Indians who were “gathered up” were the remnant who survived the provoked battles. Any objective historian will tell you that there were multiple local attempts to exterminate them.

        The main point, though, is that you do not have the right to use public schools to teach children your concept of God. Now isn’t that simple?

      • Oh my. “They were Native Americans, and they were being gathered up not exterminated.”

        @Gary – that statement should remove any credibility that anyone has granted you up to this point. If you are gullible enough to believe it, then it is no wonder that you are gullible enough to believe that your bible is anything other than fiction. I don’t want you anywhere near my children in an educational setting because you clearly don’t have a strong sense of reason. You likely don’t have the ability to determine right from wrong or fact from fallacy on your own because you simply follow instruction. That is a critical flaw for an educator.

        Individual faith is very powerful and it is something that can lead people to do great things. Our passion and drive is our gift from God, whether it be by divine intent or by the result of her successful science experiment.

        Religions – all of them – Christianity, Judaism, Islam, etc., are products of Satan. Yes, of evil. Religion is Satan’s counter-offensive to faith.

        Where faith is inspirational, religion is oppressive and corrupt. Faith and science are about learning and growing, understanding where we came from and what our destiny is. Religion is about control, oppression, and especially profit. Religions must oppress critical thinking because it devalues the supposed ‘knowledge’ of those at the top of the religious money pyramids.

        @Gary – snap out of it.

  41. Holy Christ Amighty – the pledge of alliegence was just fine in 1954 before the ultra religioius right wing republicans jammed the change down our throats. And take your religious statements off my money; It’s unconstitutional.

    • Amen, AintThatAmerica. I am alarmed at the religious nutjobs infiltrating their “creationism” and thinly veiled creationism called “intelligent design” into our school system in science classrooms. It’s not enough for them to keep their silly beliefs (the earth is only 6,000 years old; fossils were laid down by the Genesis Flood) in church and at home, but they want to control anyone they can come into contact with. Believe in any god you want, any silly thing you want, but it does not belong in the public education system.

    • I’m 56 and grew up saying the Pledge in my public school. I stopped saying it when I was in ninth grade because I wasn’t going to pledge allegiance to a country fighting what I believed to be an unjust war. I just stood there in silence while everyone else pledged. I wish the Pledge _had_ disappeared from schools the way people here keep saying it has! It’s still thriving at my kids’ independent school as well as at all the public schools around here. I think it’s silly and embarrassing to talk out loud to a flag, and I still won’t do it.

  42. I did not hear Mr. Huckabee’s comments, however, most people who say that taking God out of the schools is the cause (or a part of the cause) of violent/antisocial behavior are not referring to physically removing God, nor are they referring to God not being there to protect the innocents. Most are referring to the failure to teach the biblical values that used to be taught in schools (Love your neighbor as yourself, love the unlovely, everybody is your neighbor, etc.), and the acceptance of behaviors that used to bring discipline (disrespect, bullying, challenging authority, using the nurse’s office as a birth control center) resulting in raising up children who have no moral compass, no compassion, no esteem for the value of life. While I would agree that there are many teachers who live out the Christian values of selflessness, kindness, grace and mercy, in their jobs, their example is just that, an example. Some kids will pick up on that, but many, especially the mentally and emotionally challenged, will not. They need to be TAUGHT those skills and character traits.

    Also, the statement that teachers are “in loco parenti” is highly offensive to me and should be to any parent who has been blessed with the amazing privilege of raising up a child. The very implication that, by virtue of being a teacher, someone else has parental rights over my child is deeply troubling. That a legal term is used to perpetuate that myth is almost as troubling as the lack of outrage in response to it. I believe that is another part of the problem. Children are sent to schools where they are told they can have condoms and birth control pills and their parents won’t have to be told. Some school districts help girls to get abortions without telling their parents. How then can the real parents expect their children to honor and obey them when the school system is undermining their authority? Perhaps at least some of the angst that is felt toward some teachers today has grown from a sense on the part of the parents that the school system is working against them, instead of with them.

    Honestly, I don’t personally know anyone who harbors ill will toward the teachers or administrators at their children’s schools. Other than an occasional disagreement between teacher and parent about the best path for the child, all of the parents I know hold their children’s teachers in high regard. It is the school system itself, that seems to be constantly reinventing itself into a social engineering role, rather than a place of factual learning, that is the object of most of the anger I witness.

    • As an educator who has taught across two states and three districts, I can say with certainty that those things you lament are still very much being taught in schools. However, there are many things that schools cannot do without the support of parents. Much of what you say needs to be taught at school must also be taught in the home. School cannot be a panacea or cure-all. It is but one place, and a place that must serve the needs of many different students in many different ways.
      The best and most effective “moral compass” for students are parents/guardians. While schools and teachers can offer that to a certain extent, studies have repeatedly shown that parents have the most impact on their children, regardless of what educational institution they attend. I would like to think that I’ve been able to make a positive impact on my student’s lives, but I certainly hold no illusions that I could ever replace a parent. We may be called upon as educators to act like parents at times, giving student guidance, helping them to reflect and grow, but acting AS parents does not mean we ARE the child’s parents. That is a big difference.
      I would also ask to see the statistics or an article of the schools you say help students get abortions. I am not saying it does not exist, but I have never before heard of a school district or school being so invasive into a student’s health care decisions. I feel that if were as widespread as you suggest, it would be on the news more frequently.
      The bottom line for me is school’s are a reflection of the society. We cannot fix all you say is wrong with the schools without also looking at the homes and communities our students come from. The system will never be fixed if we continue to attack it only from one angle.

      • “The bottom line for me is school’s are a reflection of the society. We cannot fix all you say is wrong with the schools without also looking at the homes and communities our students come from. The system will never be fixed if we continue to attack it only from one angle.”

        Very well said!

    • Patricia, I’m confused. You’re offended by the PTA mom’s statement that teachers are “in loco parenti” to our children, yet you wish to burden them with the responsibility of teaching your values to your children.

    • Those values you so cherish are not limited to Christians and don’t require religion. They may appear in the bible, but they are not exclusive to Christians – something many of the religious fail to recognize. Eschewing religion doesn’t mean one is suddenly an amoral, evil person. It just means someone doesn’t follow a particular belief system.

  43. I was a public school teacher for 22 years. And I agree with Huckabee. The moral quality of our schools and our culture have declined greatly over the past 30-40 years. I saw a great decline in the attitude of students, especially in their language, the year after cable TV first arrived in our town. After 22 years in the classroom, I left teaching and embarked on 5 years of seminary training. The kids I taught didn’t need to know how to dissect a frog; they needed to know the difference between right and wrong, which many of them didn’t. I became a professional lay minister and was able to teach what young people really needed.

    • The difference between right and wrong should be taught by the parents…religion is only a tool in which to do so.

    • Right and wrong are not being taught enough at home where it should start. To many children come to school with no respect, work ethic and a belief that the can do what they want. This is the problem.

  44. I agree with the author’s perception of what resides in the school she speaks of. ..too bad she wouldn’t be allowed to read it aloud in that school, where it would do the most good. Those children need the reassurance. But no matter how she tries to say otherwise,
    it references God. A god. ANY god, and as a God of benevolent good. But therein lies the rub. It is a testimonial, and a reference to a “god”, and that….no matter how nurturing or comforting….is NOT the sort of thing allowed to be promulgated or professed in a public school.

  45. Thank you, Kimberly. You’ve renewed my faith in Christian empathy today. I was deeply saddened when Mike Huckabee’s finger-pointing almost immediately took over my social networking circles, without so much as a 24-hour waiting period of mourning for the victims of this terrible tragedy. So often I am amazed at our nation’ ability to turn anything and everything into a snarky, self-righteous, completely inappropriate political war. The soul of America is being slowly but surely devoured from within by a malignant hubris and utter disconnect from our fellow citizens. Perhaps the question Mike Huckabee should be asking is not, “Whom can we blame for this tragedy?,” but rather, “Why is it so easy for me to exploit this tragedy to bolster my own opinions?” Why is it so difficult to leave ONE DAY to mourn in solidarity and silent, heartbroken compassion for the people of Newtown? Thank you for this letter.

    • You really should go directly to the source first before you post remarks. I urge you to research and find out what Mr. Huckabee actually said and not what the liberal left misquotes him as saying.

      • I’d like to give mike Huckabee the benefit of the doubt, but his quote was:

        “We ask why there is violence in our schools, but we have systematically removed God from our schools. Should we be so surprised that schools would become a place of carnage?”

        He continued: “Maybe we ought to let [God] in on the front end and we wouldn’t have to call him to show up when it’s all said and done at the back end.”

        He’s implying a cause-and-effect, between our country’s policies and culture, and God engineering, allowing, or at best, refusing to intervene against these terrible acts, (and this case, acts upon completely uninvolved parties).

      • By saying “the liberal left” you’ve let your motivations and prejudice out of the bag. Good job at allowing us to see who you are immediately.

  46. What a heartfelt letter! As a lifelong educator I am in complete agreement with your Passion, your sentiment, and your logic. I would love Mike Huckabee to respond to his critics… I am sure there are MANY!

  47. I’ve been wanting to write this same letter for the past several days, but mine would have been laced with a lot more explicatives. Of all the responses to this tragedy I’ve heard, Huckabee’s was the least pastoral, and he is an ORDAINED BAPTIST MINISTER. Thank you for the excellent letter. I am sharing this and hoping no one else has to waste three and a half minutes of their life, as I did, listening to Huckabee’s shaming sermon.

    • Mrs. Burkett, many people do many great deed!. I can’t speak on behalf of Mike Huckabee, however I do know this! This country was founded on certain principals and these principals were so cherished that our founding fathers included them in our government. U.S. Government were sworn into office by the Word of God; they still today do the same. They celebrate the birth of Christ, by holding “Christmas” in the White House, they still do that today! They open with prayer before meetings, and the Ten Commandments were on the wall. They celebrate Christ, pray to Christ, make vows to God, and set State Laws from the Word of God! Concerning Schools, the church was built and they held schools in church buildings. They prayed before school started and pledge elegance to the flag of the United States of America and to the Republic for which it stands one nation under who? Under who? God! Which God? The one and only God from the bible that was included in the Bible Studies. Using the Word of God they taught about Jesus and celebrated Christmas at the Public Schools from the beginning and on up to when I went to school in 1974! Not sure which God you’re talking about but my God does not believe in teaching children of any age anything that might promote sex before marriage! Many people do great deeds but that doesn’t mean they come from the God that the United States have served for so many years in our schools and our government! Good deeds only get you so far and then eventually they die because the bible teaches that there is no good in us and if we are to achieve any goodness it will only be through the Father. The Father, in the Word of God that our founding Fathers and others felt so deeply for, they included Him in our schools and our government! I’m not taking away from anybodies good deeds, because even my works are like filthy rags. But when Jesus, the Jesus from the Word of God, that the founding Fathers felt so strongly about they were willing to make vows to, when He uses a person, then those works are perfect works! I’m not asking you to believe like me, But I do wanted you to know, that’s the God, Jesus, that I serve and it’s the same Lord, Jesus our founding Fathers serve! God didn’t allow the school shootings, we allow it to happen. It’s like your child that decides to run from you in a parking lot full of moving cars, if that child runs from you, did you allow he or she to get run over? No, your child was just simply out of your reach! We are out of His Reach!

      • Um, “under God” was added to the Pledge of Allegiance in the 1950′s as way to distinguish Americans from communists. You sound like you want to go back to the good old days of the 18th century, when women weren’t educated and couldn’t vote and anyone who wasn’t a Protestant was persecuted. its like the WASP version of the Taliban. Serve whatever god you want, but don’t try to institutionalize your personal god in the public schools. Time marches on, we have a diverse society, and our constitution says “Congress shall make no law respecting the establishment of religion”.

      • Chris- The world was a very different place in the era that you speak about. Our founding fathers may have included God, and prayer and the 10 commandments in daily ritual, but the vast majority did not live up to the standards of Jesus Christ. Slavery was emerging as one of the greatest evils of our history; women were treated as second class citizens and we were on the verge of committing heinous genocide against Native American people. The founding fathers were wise, and this ignorance sickened them throughout the meetings of the Continental Congress, but they had to pick and choose their battles in a rush to come to an agreement as imminent war approached them. They had the foresight, however, to include insurance that the laws of this great nation could be changed at the time when people were ready to evolve. So that once the majority of the country became more educated, worldly and civilized – as they were – we could protect our nation from crazy zealots, such as yourself. I will pray for you that you too one day will become educated and civilized enough to realize that the world is made up of many groups and religions. And that your God is most likely their God too, but He has taken a different form to reach different peoples. I will pray that His wrath against you, for your blindness to their equality, is not too great. Remember- Jesus was persecuted by people like yourself who were blind to the possibilities of other religions. A school is not the place for people to argue over whose religion is the right one.

      • Chris, The founding Fathers did not set up the public school system. In the beginning people taught their children at home. Then evangelicals started schools to teach immigrant children. After a Catholic priest protested to the mayor of New York that they were changing the students religion from Catholic to Prodistant that the first public school system was set up.

      • Chris, is your nalast name Huckabee. Kimberly is a very good example of a Christian. You on the other hand a the perfect example of the evangelical right wing morons that make up the tea party. We do not need you prayer, 10 commandments, religious leaders and presidential rejects like Huckabeedegrading the system because the system doesn’t fit in your little trifiling hole of religion. I am an atheist and support people like Kimberly who use a great amount of reason when making decisions, instead of relying on a bronze age superstition that was stolen from previuos civilizations to attempt to control and punish their people. Did you threaten your kids with eternal damnation yesterday? People like you are child abusers for threatening your kids that they will go to hell and burn forever if they do not toe the xian line. I refuse to worship a god that says he loves you if you worship him. but if you do not you will burn in hell. Sounds like an immature child to me.

      • If Christians and other religious groups really want to better the plight of American children then they should start paying their taxes! It is an outrage that churches do not pay taxes. The amount of money that would be collected is staggering, it would go a long, long way to paying teachers a proper salary. Teachers not only educate our child, feed and sometimes even clothe them out of their own pocket, they are there to protect them when terror strikes.

      • I will say again and again someday ,no one knows when we all will individually stand before GOD and answer to HIM how we have lived our life. No one but I,myself can answer that. I don’t remember ever seeing a Bible until I started to school. I first learned about Jesus in a one room school house. I was 8 years old before I started going to a church .I had good parents ,my father died tragically when I was small. My mother took
        care of all her children. We all finished high school and became good
        citizens. I have very little knowledge of any Faith other than Christian and reading and following God’s Word. WE as a whole in this country have forgotten what morals and loving each other is all about. If these things are brought back into our lives this country will see change. Lets take care of the Mentally sick so that things like what happened last week don’t happen.
        We wait for the other person to do something about it. It’ swept under the rug (so to speak) by our government. Lets take care of our own. Charity begins at home. My heart goes out to these families and to the people in our schools who try to do right.

      • Lesli, if churches are to start paying taxes, then so should the Red Cross, the Salvation Army, March of Dimes, and every other organization that operates on donations. Churches do not operate a business, they don’t make a product to sell, they don’t make profits, or do anything else to earn or make money, nor do they force people to give. Everything a church receives is given voluntarily. And the money that is given has already been taxed once. Also, you may not know that a Pastor is considered self-employed, and thus pays twice the percentage of Social security tax that you do.

  48. Thank you for this beautifully written letter! And thank your husband and his staff as well. I, too, am a teacher and do my best to be a living example of Christ’s love for my students. As a catholic in a public school, I do not teach my students about the lives of saints, or to pray the Rosary. But my classroom is filled with love and acceptance, caring and kindness. As you so wonderfully stated, God is present in classrooms and schools throughout our country. Mr. Huckabee, and others of his ilk, would know this if they ever visited. But, I don’t believe they ever would- The truth would prove contrary to their beliefs.

    • @njg yes the government should establish no law. this is so misrepresented and misunderstood. this means the government can not say everyone MUST be Christian and attend Baptist churches for example. Or that all federal workers must be catholic. This is the polar opposite of what the soviet block did when it banned religious practice. Our country has never done this . It has however said prayers,celebrated holidays and said if you don’t want to participate then don’t. we have gone way over the deep end on this so they we attempt to restrict all display of religion instead of teaching tolerance of ALL religions.

  49. I often here this question asked when tragedies like this happens “Where was God that he would allow this to happen”? The answer is simple as he is right where people put him.

    • Let me understand your position. You’re saying that God abandoned 20 innocent children and their teachers because of school policies that NONE of them had anything to do with? Seriously? That god sounds like a politician. Why would anyone devote themselves to such a narcissistic god? What a disgrace.

      • Have you have ever heard of satan or the devil? He works to be where ever God is not every second of the day. I am not sure if you believe or not but I would not ever want a life without my God it in. He was there and it was tragic. He was weeping I am sure, but I have faith he welcomed 27 angels that day. I pray all were believers and were welcomed into His arms.

      • No, he is saying that a society that pays no attention to the spiritual (God-centered) development of children (or adults) is an open target for the evil that is developed to be unleashed on innocent children. He is noting that the symbols of God are missing as evidence that people don’t care about God and that they have no time for God and that they don’t even want to talk or think about God. Not that the symbols themselves have any inherent power. He is not saying that those children were evil…he is saying a society that influenced the shooter has too many evil influences–not that the school or the children individually are evil (or in any way deserved to be murdered.). He is only framing an argument that is supported by polls and many statistics. That fewer and fewer Americans actually believe in God.

      • Yep, thats what he is saying. Like all the other ignorant right wing xians. They are pissed because people are seeing their religion for what it is lies and hatred. A bronze age superstition headed by ignorant leaders that cannot work anywhere else because they have no decernable skills to market, so they must continue to spew the lies and hatred because that is the only marketable skill that they have.

    • The shooter was also one of Gods children..As senseless as death and murder are from my experience our Lord will take us in any way he can..Does this sound too brutal for our God to do this thing? What do you all think death is? Definitely not a choice we make..I believe this because I lost my son in a motor cycle accident. At 19 it was his time to be with God..I was lucky God showed me this. It didn’t make it easy or right by me but the Lord wanted him home. Hard to believe God kills a lot of people at once isn’t it? He creates everything on this earth. He moves our lives in the directions we are supposed to go. He will send an earthquake to take out many and sort them out..Tsunamis, tornadoes, floods..While we should never tempt the hand of God with our free choice and doing wrong things ,continue to strive to walk in his ways and not the ways we want.

      • All I can say is jeez. I can understand you sadnes for the loss of your son. But you can’t be serious. God took him home? He died in a motorcycle accident. it happens every day. At 19, statistically he had a 50% better chance of getting killed on his bike because he was most likely not operating it in a safe manner. I know you see it every day on the highway. It is no message from God. It is your mind trying to make sense of your loss. I am deeply saddened for you, but don’t delude yourself that God had his hand in this. Remember your all powerful God that is large enough to create the universe. The universe of billions of galaxies and trillions of stars has no interest in what happens on some inconsequencial planet orbiting around a small star in a galaxy of 128 billion stars. Ms. Haines i hope your God brings you peace if that is what makes you happy. But please stop trying to convince the rest of us it was devine intervention that you son was killed. Peace be with you.

      • Do not listen to this idiot! When got is ready for us! He will take us home! It can be in any way, form or fashion.

    • For God not being in this country, there sure are a lot of churches. It saddens me to hear people make this type of statement, especially when there are children involved. What do six year olds know about abandoning God? The God I know would not leave those children to prove a point to the rest of the heathen mob.

    • If you often “HEAR” this question, let me ask you. How in your right mind believe in a “god” who is such a petulant little child, that unless people pay attention to him 24/7 – he takes his “wrath” out on 20 six and seven year olds in the most horrific way? Each one of these children (and the teachers) were well known in the community and all attended a church or synagogue. One of those children who was “slaughtered” for lack of “god” in their lives was slated to be an angel in a nativity play THAT VERY NIGHT. Why didn’t “god” save her? CLEARLY she had god in her life is she was going to play one of his cherubs. You, like all other extreme zealots believe it’s your way or the highway. Here’s a clue for you: We are onto your agenda, and we’re not going to allow it to take over.

      • Angel, I have to ask, why is it that every time I see your name above a post, something hateful and condescending follows? You have spoken in earlier posts about being able to “see who you are immediately”, but it seems that you haven’t the slightest idea of how your hatefulness and ignorance toward a set of beliefs is turning people away from what you’re saying. If you want to be heard, reach out with compassion, which can be done while disagreeing. No one is making you believe anything, and no one will. Christians can push all they want for more talk of God in the public setting, but ultimately we all know that you have the right to believe how you want to believe. Stop trying to condemn Christians for having their own set of beliefs (even if that includes the belief that Creationism should be taught in schools) because they differ from your own. You’re doing the exact thing that you’re condemning everyone else for.

  50. Pingback: climbingatree.com | dancing between destiny and choice. » Blog Archive » God, Schools, and Tragedy: Part 2

  51. I find this “PTA” mom disingenuous from the get-go..she is actually the wife of a public school principal but I guess if she prefaced her remarks as such they might not have sounded as good. I heard Mr.Huckabee’s actual speech that she has distorted and I might add that as Governor of the State of Arkansas for more than 8 years Mr.Huckabee has a lot of experience with public school systems and separating his own personal belief from those required of a public servant.
    I read his book “From Hope to Higher Ground” and although I am by no means a Christian believer in his style I saw nothing in that book nor in his actual time as governor that would substantiate or justify the rant Ms.Burkett laid upon his head.

    • But she wasn’t misquoting him at all. The implication of Huckabee’s words is that God is excluded from public schools and thahie fording Christianity with symbols is more important than living a Christ-like example by feeding, educating, mentoring, and loving on children. The author of this article is spot-on. Besides, as one commenter mentioned, “what Huckabee implies in his message is that if we “bring God back” into the schools and make Him the center of our lives that He will rescue us from all evil. That is not what Christianity teaches. This world is a broken, sinful world, and it’s been that way since the Garden of Eden. We cannot praise, or honor, or love God into delivering us from all suffering. That is preposterous, and false teaching.” And what does the author’s being the wife of a public school principal have to do with anything?

      • if one uses the argument that the children and educators died because somehow GOD was taken out of schools then maybe someone that believes that can tell me why those parishoners had to die in a Texas church? Why did those alter boys have to be raped and sodomized inside a church? Did someone take GOD out of there or do people have a brand new reason for those happenings?

      • I don’t think Mr. Huckabee was trying to say that putting God back in school (or public for that matter) would solve all the evil that most assuredly surrounds us. Christ teaches love and no matter how much any individual “does” for another, if they cannot love them, they aren’t helping them. Sometimes that love comes in the form of getting that person help they desperately need, even if that means forced mental help. This country is plagued by mental health issues that are never addressed–mostly because health ins doesn’t want to pay for it. ALL the school shootings in the past 20 years can be traced back to a mental illness problem within the shooter. THIS is the issue we MUST begin talking about. Talking about our “feelings” on whether or not Mr Huckabee or anyone else has said what they should say, how they should say it, it just a waste of time and energy. LETS TALK ABOUT THE REAL ISSUE AND STOP RANTING ABOUT WHAT DOESN’T MATTER.

      • No one has said anything derrogatory about the wonderful teachers and all that they do. The point is that prayer has the power to change and effect the souls of children. Prayers are not just empty words devoid of life or power. Prayer invokes the Holy Spirit who IS life and love and hope to enter the lives and hearts of children. The knowledge of God, who He is and what His laws are, which include respecting and valuing every life as sacred and God given, is what develops the conscience of mankind. The bible and the ten commandments are where our laws originated from. They are the very foundation for our civil society. That’s why it’s important to aknowledge God through prayer and teach them basic bible lessons. He is a living God and he lives and moves among those who invite and welcome Him into their daily lives. He is such a loving and good God, not narcissistic as one person so shamefully acused Him to be, that He will not violate your free will to choose Him.So, it’s our choice, but it’s to our detriment if we deny public aknowledgement. Jesus said in Matthew 10:33 “But whoever denies Me before men, I will also deny him before My father who is in heaven”

      • The real problem is that morality has been abandoned in our culture – everywhere, not just the schools. Religion of any kind needs to be taught early and often. Without God there is the absence of the value of life. When we murder our unborn, our young people see there is a lack of respect for human life.
        Our culture has made it very difficult, even for the religious schools.
        Thanks to the governments interference in all matters and the ACLU, our society is going downhill. The rights of a few have become more important than the rights of the majority. We will destroy our country without any assistance from outside forces.

    • Jordan, how is she misquoting Huckabee? He said, point blank, God has been systematically removed from public schools, ergo people shouldn’t be shocked that public schools are places of carnage. I’m not seeing how Kimberly misrepresented his remarks.

    • you really really need to volunteer in some public schools. especially those in the inner city, jordan. reading books aren’t the real thing my dear. it’s in these actual schools where the love occurs. i taught for 20 years in the inner city in little rock. i treasure every moment.

      • To Jordon and all the other supposed xians that commented against the author of this comment. It matters not whether she prefaced her comments with her stance in her private life. She is 100% correct. But like most of you other so called christians you lack any sort of reason and logic. You blindly follow leaders like Huckleberry and spew your religious retoric. Then get insulted when someone calls you out on it. “Oh you are picking on us”. You don’t want to get shot at, then stop sticking your head up in the war on logic. Because that is really what this is about. How can a logical, thinking person with an IQ of over 100 buy into your lies and hate. That is what the war on religion is about. Rescuing this country from bronze age superstition and worship that has been passed down for 15,000 years by people that are afraid to be responsible for their lives. You responders that rail against Kimberly are disgusting. Yes you have your right to free speech, but you are still disgusting, childish and stupid. Open your eyes, think, reason and open you very closed minds.

  52. Your letter brought me to tears and prompted me to pass it along. God bless you and God bless us, every one.

  53. “FOR THE LOVE OF GOD,” Kimberley. Mr. Huckabee is certainly entitled to his opinion, as are you. But while the public schools and teacher unions are politically & socially challenged, this has nothing to do with the horrifically EVIL act that occured in CT… or the religious-based comments of Mr. Huckabee. At least you could refrain from misquoting him… as you know (from the editor’s links) he was referring to the everyday religious subleties such as not using “under God” in the Pledge of Allegiance, or removing crosses from war memorials, etc. I am actively praying for the families, community, and nation trying to deal with this senseless tragedy… I will also pray that God will help YOU and whatever PTA you are affiliated with to better cope with your “anger and hatred” issues with those who might have a different view than yours. Have a blessed day…

    • hey mo.. you are the one with anger and hate issues ou are exactly what is wrong with your brand of ‘christians’ because you are not in any way a christian so keep your prayers or pray for yourself.

      • No Marilyn you are a close minded, hate mongering xian that wants their say but cannot think of ahything but your bronze age retoric, lies and hatred when your so called leaders are call out on thier ignorant comments.

    • I don’t think she was misquoting him at all. The implication of Huckabee’s words is that God is excluded from public schools and that having Him represented by crosses, bible reading, etc., is more important than loving and mentoring children. The author of this article is spot-on. Besides, what Huckabee implies in his message is that if we “bring God back” into the schools and make Him the center of our lives that He will rescue us from all evil. That is not what Christianity teaches. This world is a broken, sinful world, and it’s been that way since the Garden of Eden. We cannot praise, or honor, or love God into delivering us from all suffering. That is preposterous, and false teaching.

    • But she didn’t misquote Huckabee, nor did she misrepresent what he said. He said “we have systematically removed God from our schools,” and she quoted him as saying that very thing, except she paraphrased “our” as “public” — surely a distinction without a difference. You suggest Huckabee was referring to “everyday religious subleties [sic]” and she suggests that Huckabee denounced schools for “removing…symbols of God” — again, a distinction without a difference. When a public figure talks about a national tragedy with knee-jerk religious language, don’t be surprised when people respond appropriately. And about those anger and hatred issues: people in glass houses…

    • Woah. Mo. There is no anger or hatred in this post. Sounds like you need some help with *your* issues dealing with people who have a different view than yours if all you can do is go to (false) accusations and blame shifting.

    • What an inappropriate response to a beautifully written letter. I saw no anger and hatred in it, only heartbreak over Mr. Huckabee’s inability to recognize the loving Christian work done in our public schools. And the writer is correct. I have worked as a parent volunteer in the schools for 12 years–for my daughter’s entire public school education–and now I work as an instructional aide. Teachers are among God’s most faithful servants, and they serve the little children whom Jesus himself thought closest to the kingdom of heaven. I am a Christian and I see God in the public schools every day.

    • Mo..with all due respect the quote is verbatim and mr. Huckabee also said after the shootings in Colorado that we had “forced God” from schools. The point he was making was pretty clear to all of us too..and he has made it repeatedly…absence of overt Christian prayer and overt discussion of God in the public sphere results in chaos…in fact he said something almost exactly like that after the Colorado shootings. Kimberly’s point was that teachers do good works and God is present even without the overt signs…and that supporting teachers instead of denigrating them would be a far better use of Mr. Huckabee’s energy…as another teacher’s spouse I don’t see that as even close to off-base.

      • if some people think that he was misquoted or taken out of context why did he have to go on two different shows 2 days in a row tell people he didn’t really mean that. And to the person commenting on him being a governor for 8 yrs no he was our governor for 10 yrs 10 verrrrryyyy loooong years. front page daily for ethics problems got mad when he could not keep bass boats and 1000.00 dollar suits from someone (Jennings osbourne) that wanted political favors, got mad when the people of Arkansas did not wnat his wife Jethrine as our SOS while he was governor. Saving the best for last he paroled Maurice Clemmons because he thought he had a good heart……………Clemmons went to WA with that good heart and murdered 4 police officers. So don’t tell me about that POS.

    • Mr. Huckabee? He doesn’t deserve to be called Mr. I call people I respect Mr. This bafoon is nothing but a religious charlatan.

  54. First of all, I want to state very clearly that I am not an overly “religious” person. However, I do believe in a Supreme power, a Creator. I believe in God.

    That being said, I have listened to Mike Huckabee many times. I believe he believes in what he is saying. When he was running for president, I thought he channeled his faith into his candidacy to his own detrimate. Still, he clung to his beliefs.

    All that being said, I want to make one more statement.

    There is little doubt that this nation as whole does not worship as it did a hundred years ago or even forty years ago. While I am no fan of government in general, either (reference Founding Fathers), I must say that the government has done nothing to take God out of the schools. The only way to do that is to take people out of the schools that believe in God. The government cannot mandate a belief for or against anything..

    That power still resides in our homes and within our family/community structure.

    Have a very Merry Christmas.

    Tim

    • It is God’s Word and not God that we have removed as God is Omnisicient and “unremoveable”. His Word, His Truth is not allowed to be communicated. This is the tragedy of our public schools and public discourse. We have lost a once held belief in the power of knowing truth. We are fearful of ANYTHING or ANYONE who might suggest absolutes. This would include the Bible itself and anyone who would interject it into the public discourse, which is where Mr. Huckabee comes in. Those of us who believe in absolutes, such as “Thou shalt not murder” or “Judge not that you be not judged” (which is what it seems the writer of the article is doing to Mr. Huckabee), tremble knowing the consequences when we abandon God and His Word. As a nation, a people, we are deceived and living in a cloud of unreality which makes for chaos.

      • My question is why is that the job of schools? If you want that for your child, there are private schools. I personally don’t want anyone teaching my child about religion, because that is my job. What if a child’s teacher told him/her something about religion that you did not agree with? Or that your denomination didn’t believe? How would we as educator’s serve the needs of our Catholic, Baptist, Jehovah’s Witness, Methodist, Episcopalian, Jewish, and Muslim students? Each religious denomination has its own sub-set of beliefs, many of which don’t transfer to other denominations.
        What you say sounds reasonable on its face, but with the student populations we teach is not really feasible. What IS more feasible, however, is to teach the values that most denominations do agree on: humility, grace, love, charity. All of these can be taught without referencing a particular scripture. By excluding the particular scripture, no one is saying it does not exist, just that this one public space is not the place to learn about it. That is what family and houses of worship are for.
        And incidentally, anyone can pray anywhere, at any time of day. No one can legislate your thoughts, nor should they.

  55. Thank you for an absolutely wonderful letter. I hope Mr. Huckabee reads it and has the Christian compassion to understand it

  56. Beautiful! Thank you from the daughter of a teacher who shared God and Jesus to countless young children and their families for many years. As I read your descriptions of today’s educators, I could see my mother and my boys’ teachers both now and in years past. I am also reminded of my own teachers. You are so right–God never did leave the classroom, and He will never leave His children.

  57. Amen! Amen! Amen!

    You my dear woman – Please hug your husband for me – and thank him for all he and his staff do everyday!

    One PTA Mom to another — You took the words right out of my mouth! Tho likely more eloquantly then I could have mustered given my lack of sleep this past week.

    Have a blessed Christmas!

    Garsy

  58. Reblogged this on Views from the Hill and commented:
    This is a great piece in response to the ignorance shown by the likes of Huckabee and some of the politicians ranting about arming teachers and principals. The level of ignorance espoused by these fools is beyond comprehension.

  59. Thank you for this heartfelt letter and response to the ignorant rantings of Mike Hukabee. After I heard his cowardly statements, I went immediately to his website, which interestingly, was blocked from taking comments.

    You have nailed it. Hukabee and others like him are playing to the radio ratings, knowing that the more outrageous they are on the air, the higher the ratings with the far-right wing nuts they are playing to.

    I can’t imagine a better description of God’s work than what you’ve outlined about the work going on in your school, and thousands of others across this country. How we can play games and politicize public education is beyond me. This isn’t a short sightedness problem, this is one of self-centered greed and ignorance. This country has passed its apex, and is on a slippery slope downward becuase of the likes of Hukabee and others, both in radio “entertainment” and in politics.

    Well, thats enough for now. Thanks so much for writing this piece, I hope it goes viral. I’m reblogging it myself.

    Best

  60. Thank you for this letter. I am a teacher and I do feel like I am doing God’s work. Serving children is my calling from God. AND I pray EVERY day in school! No one keeps me from my prayers! I just am not required to pray someone else’s prayer (and for that, I am thankful.)

  61. THANK YOU! From a teacher who burned out hard in the grinding machine of test prep and predatory accountability, underfunding, overcrowding, and mind-numbing mandatory curriculums (10 years of teaching), thank you for for this.

  62. this woman is misquoting. Huckabee never said anything about educators. But more importantly, his message stated specifically and succinctly that the removal of God from schools was NOT the reason for the violence. His very clear message was that removal of positive attitudes (religion being one) has left a dark environment that breeds and feeds mental illness and horror. This kind of loose-cannon indignance makes her cause look ignorant, and helps no one.

    • Steve, I work in the children’s mental health field and “positive attititudes” and/or religious beliefs do not make ANYONE immune to mental ILLNESS just as it doesn’t to cancer. Underline the word “illness”….there are actual chemical imbalances, structural brain abnormalities amongst many other physical factors, genetics, that can often be responsibile-it’s not all because someone was either abused or tramautized as a child which is often a harmful misperception. Let’s not forget that sadly even those in the most highest regarded religious positions also commit hideous and senseless crimes against children! Mental illness doesn’t discriminate…………and can effect individuals at random times in their lives despite their “environment”, upbringing, education, religious foundation (that belongs as a private and personal choice to be fostered at HOME-definitely not one that needs implementation in our public schools). And of course-I don’t want to imply that all criminals have some type of mental illness-that’s not always the case either…there is just plain evil out there and there’s just NO simple answer how we deal with that-it’s been there from day one and floods our history!

    • You are right, I listened to this and thought it was a reasonable, positive commentary on the state of religious values in schools today. Nothing negetive was stated about the teachers and nothing was stated about reading from the bible.
      Her overly emotional response to a thoughtful and logical statement only proves her own ingnorance and her lack of comprehension.

    • Huckabee said, “”We don’t have a crime problem, a gun problem or even a violence problem. What we have is a sin problem,” Huckabee said on Fox News. “And since we’ve ordered God out of our schools, and communities, the military and public conversations, you know we really shouldn’t act so surprised … when all hell breaks loose.”"

      Let me rephrase what you wrote to make sense: “his message stated specifically and succinctly that the removal of God from schools WAS the reason for the violence.”

      TIFI.

      • Thank you TIFI, but you waste your breath on the ignorance of the religious in this country. There is a saying, ” If you could reason with religious people, there would be no religion”. I post comments because I simply can’t sit and let them spew their warped morality and not offer my opinion. And I will say until my dying breath, “If a person is gullible enough to believe the religious rantings of these zealots, then you deserve to waste the only life you get following some bronze aged superstitution invented to control the masses and promote hatred and bigotry.” Not how I want to spend what is left of my life.

    • Thank you Steve, I heard Mike Huckabee’s comments and you are exactly right. This writer is misrepresenting what he said.

  63. This doesn’t sound like something from a Texas teacher. Texas doesn’t have teachers unions so the mention of such is a bit confusing. Also I think this person may be living in a bubble or something…My husband has been in education (and I have also worked closely in many different schools) for over 30 years and as with all professions there are good teachers and there are bad teachers. Also having been in education for that long we have personally seen the deterioration of learning and discipline in the classroom because of all the bureaucratic regulations with which teachers are fettered today.

    • Those ‘bureaucratic regulations” have been put in place by Right Wing legislators in the hopes of pushing their brand of mis-education into the system, and thereby weakening it. Then they can say “hey, public schools don’t work…let’s privatize ‘em”…and make a profit. Discipline and respect, by the way….ARE LEARNED AT HOME.

      • Try again. It’s the other wing that’s into “regulations”. Conservatives believe in “fewer regulations”. Any monkey that’s opened up a newspaper in the last 100 years could tell you that. Nobody wants schools to fail – what a ridiculous and moronic comment. Discipline and respect may in fact supposed to be taught at home but thanks to liberal policies and all of the left-wing “we can’t hurt anyones feelings” crap, kids get away with murder these days. And, good teachers often get screwed, too because kids are un-touchable because Mommy and Daddy can sue if their little princess or prince isn’t worshiped in class.

      • In good loving and positive families, discipline and respect along with sex education are learned at home. Unfortunatly too many parents these days do not pay enough attention to their kids and teach them the basics to get by in society at home. There are children everywhere who are great, and there are those who have never been given a foundation to start with. As the letter states, many children get the only nurturing and teaching in their lives from teachers. Kudos for teachers, not so much for some parents.

    • Sorry to tell you that you are serious misinformed. There are two teachers’ unions in Texas. One has been around for over a century. Both are thriving. And both are very important components in improving education in Texas and standing up to the legislators that steal money from the public schools.

      • At least not in the sense of other states (forced to join)…I have never really looked at TSTA, ATPE, etc.as “unions” any more than the THSCA and TGCA are unions for coaches…

    • Sounds like me, for one. Speak for yourself, please, and not for a heterogeneous group of people whom you don’t know.

  64. Pingback: An Open Letter from a PTA Mom to Mike Huckabee: A Message for Those Who Long for God’s Presence in Schools « Run4joy59's Blog

  65. I do not understand this comment at all. Mr. Huckabee, never said one bad word about or educators. This is not even about our different religions. This is about taking God out of the whole equation!!!!!

    • If you believe that God is so weak, that God CAN be removed, then your faith sucks and you deserve all the crap you get. You CANNOT remove God…you can only ADD people to make you BELIEVE that God CAN be removed.

      • I am not a very religious person, but I do believe in a ‘God’. Thank you Keith because you are correct regarding that you cannot just remove God…he is everywhere!

      • you are spewing foolishness mr. wright. Of course we cannot move God to do anything He doesn’t want to do. He will leave of His own if He wishes to do so. The problem is we have left Him. You also need to understand that you are accountable to Him with your words and actions.

      • Look in the eyes of a child, there you will see God.! Donald R Vineburg, Educator 1955-2012 and still going!

    • Well, Linda, I don’t understand what you don’t get about this!!! The whole point of this PTA Mom’s letter is that God’s love is shown in public schools all the time. As one Tulsa teacher put it, and as a teacher who has been in lock-downs in elementary school, with first graders, I can personally attest to; any of us would do that for our children. Because we love them! People need to realize it doesn’t matter how you quote what Scripture. What matters is if you live your life according to those standards. This letter is a factual statement which, in the most erudite and beautiful way, recognizes that anything God could ask for children is, at the very least, attempted every minute of a teacher’s day. As a retired teacher I cannot tell you how much this letter meant to me. Thank you PTA Mom. Thank you, thank you, thank you!!!
      With love,

  66. PTA Mom, I live next to Newtown CT and I want to thank you. As a practicing Jew, I want to thank you. The religious education of my children is the responsibility of my wife and I. I don’t want the government stepping into that very private part of my life. Further, as a lover of the diverse mosiac that is America, I don’t want our government to interfere in that part of life of my neighbor’s live. I believe that if a child wishes to pray on their own, that should be permitted. However, I don’t want any school authority requiring my children to pray because the next step is that authority telling my children HOW to pray.

    My God is loving. My God is in our schools. My God is everywhere. Governmental rules do not prevent my God from any building.

    • thank you D Propper, my sentiments exactly. God does not allow himself to be locked out of a school simply because we dont have the students pray in the fashion that our some individuals would deem worthy. God IS everywhere.

    • @D…my point EXACTLY. The problem is not God being REMOVED…it is the evil like Huckabee that lead you to believe that God CAN be removed. THEY are the problem because they make God into this weak being that caves into the whims of humans.

      • Again? Please… can I send you some crayons and coloring book? No one said anything about God caving into human whims. God is a jealous God, and wants us to have no other God’s before Him. This nation is FULL of people who worship themselves and their ideals, and their cars and cell phones…and any other STUFF they can dream up to occupy their time. Hearing how you continually try and beat down Mr Huckabee, I would bet you are a democrat.

    • Thank you D…I also don’t live far from Newtown. Religion is something that should be taught at home with family. Maybe tolerance and respect is what is needed for the schools to teach.

      • Tolerance and respect have always been taught in public schools for the most part. Of course there are always exceptions, but public schools, not parochial, private schools, embrace ALL races, religions, non-religions, and every other thing that could be used to separate us from each other. The way to learn to live in a diverse world is to be with others and treat them with respect and the expectation that they will treat you that way. It saddens me so deeply that this country still has so many haters who are willing to destroy the union because their candidate didn’t win; that some think to protect their right to have whatever weapon they want doesn’t infringe on my right to live in a safe community/country; that some people still think the color of skin is a factor of any kind in determining treatment/rights/equality. That their “religion” is the only and best. I am 65 and I thought by now people would’ve learned. Sad.

  67. Pingback: Area PTA Mom Trashes Mike Huckabee for ‘Political Posturing’ Following Sandy Hook | FrontBurner

  68. Well PTA mom maybe you ought to study how our public education was during our nations early foundations. Maybe you ought to read about their outdated technology and overcrowded classrooms and then look at their test scores. Compare them to todays test scores and you’ll see just how our education system has really dumbed down our children. Maybe you ought to go back and see what they taught to 4th graders and also how they taught real history and not revised history. Maybe you ought to compare the test scores from those who were in the public education system prior to 1962 (the year we took God out of School) and compare to the test scores today. Maybe Mrs. PTA mom if the murderer had read, “Thou shalt not kill” he may have believed it and obeyed it. Then he wouldn’t have killed 27 people. Maybe if the public education was in the buisness of teaching morality as well academia, we as a nation wouldn’t be in the boat we are in. I’m not sorry to say but Mr. Huckabee was right.

    • Brandon, So you think public schools should teach morality? Is there anything left for the parents to do? If the children came to school with one simple rule: Do unto others as you would have them do unto you all would go well. As a teacher of mentally ill adolescents for over 30 years I had 3 rules. 1.Respect yourself 2. Respect others 3. Respect property. Eventually I realized that the only rule needed was Respect yourself. It covers it all. No religion should be imposed on innocent school children. in the public schools. They should come to school with some level of decency….

      • What is wrong with teaching morality in the classroom? Morality and imposing religious beliefs do not necessarily go hand-in-hand. I am all for parents taking on this subject at home but what about the children who do not have active parents who want to sit down with their kids and talk to them about right and wrong? Many children look to their teachers and educators as role models for them and people they can confide in. This is sad, but true. Children need to be taught at an early age about smart decision-making, knowing one’s decisions have consequences, etc… I believe Mr. Huckabee was not preaching that there needs to be more religion in schools.

      • Unfortunately, some parents aren’t doing a good job at teaching morality at home. If it was being done then there would not be these senseless crimes of killing a child for there new basketball shoes.

    • We did not give the same tests in 1962, so I am not sure what you are talking about. Also, you misspelled BUSINESS. PTA Mom has written an excellent letter. Thanks to her for presenting the truth so eloquently.

    • Good Lord, are you that Blind???? Whose “GOD” should we teach????? Last time I looked we were in a country where people could believe in any “GOD” they choose. Your comment and the comments of this so called “preacher of god” make me ashamed to be talking about this unspeakable event with anger. Keep your piece of garbage religion out our schools and out of our lives.

    • You’ve got to be kidding. First of all, teaching Scripture and morality is not going to cure someone with a severe personality disorder like this shooter. And what about his mother – stockpiling weapons while seemingly unaware of her son’s condition. Isn’t it the parent’s job to provide their kids the help they need as well as instilling values and ethics? Oh, and it’s the far right religious zealots who are trying to rewrite history.

    • How about the fact that the mom was a “doomsdayer” and acquiring an arsenal for the end of days? Where is the God in that? Where is the God that this woman exposed her child to this kind of mental abuse (cuz THAT is what it was) for years? Where is the God that never saw this child get the help he needed? Tell me, Brandon and Mr. Huckabee, where is the God? I am one to believe that if there was more God in the home (not the doomsday, kill ‘em all God, either, but the ‘love thy neighbor, thou shall not kill” one..) this would not be a problem.

      You want your child to learn about God? That is what Sunday School and Bible studies are for.

      It is not the public educational system’s responsibility to teach our children about right and wrong. That burden rests on the shoulders of the parents. Too many times these people have children and think nothing more. Pass it off to the grandparents, pass it off to Daycare, sit it in front of the satellite TV, pay no real attention to it then point the finger every and anywhere but where it truly belongs when it does something as horrible as this.

      You blame this on the lack of God in school? Nothing else came to mind first and foremost?

      You wanna place blame? Blame the mother that didn’t care enough about her child’s mental state, but sure as hell made sure she spent the money that could have gone to help him in acquiring more ammo for an hypothetical situation that may (or more likely may *not*) happen.

      Place the blame on our gun laws that allowed this woman to amass an arsenal without having someone knocking on her door to ensure the safety of herself, her family or community.

      Leave God out of it.

    • In 1962, the year you cite, Brandon, as the year that we took God out of schools, we had frequent lynchings in this country, as well as Jim Crow and a host of other societal ills. You remember a myth. And if you claim to be a Christian, your snarky tone toward the writer of this letter is unbecoming to your faith.

      • In 1962, on my schoolbus in Rochester, NY, the bus driver pulled over, took out a rifle, and told us children that if we didn’t shut up, he would shoot us. That same year, my teacher told us not to catch snowflakes on our tongues or we would be poisoned by radioactivity, and the Jewish kids in the school had to sit on the stairs while the rest of us sang Christmas carols. In 1962, many disabled children weren’t allowed to attend public schools at all. In 1962 we still had air-raid drills in school because “the Communists” might bomb us. Good times, good times at the public schools in 1962.

    • Why is it the responsibility of the teachers to teach morality? I’ve always believed that was the parents’ responsibility and then it was reinforced at school. If you want to compare test scores from a time long ago, then you must also compare the curriculum from both eras. When I was in elementary school in the 60′s, we learned multiplication, division, fractions, and decimals. Our elementary students are now learning algebra and geometry. When I was in elementary school we took SRA tests that only a moron couldn’t do well on. Students now take very in-depth benchmark exams that require much more higher level learning. Additionally, during the 60′s and before, life was much more simple with a lot less distractions. There were no video games, dish networks, internet, cell phones, etc. Are you really blaming a decline in test scores on the fact that we don’t read a Bible verse every morning before class starts? If so, then you are completely misguided on the problems of the public education system.

      • Teachers must have some responsibility for teaching kids how to behave toward one another and how to problem solve in social situations – so that’s a sort of morality. Parents don’t have their kids with them all day long so can’t address every situation that arises. I have my kids at home (and out in groups and classes, so not isolated). Teaching mutual respect is an ongoing process that is enhanced as situations arise – not something that is taught solely outside of school hours and therefore the responsibility of parents only, but of any caretakers or other people kids are spending their time with.

        I really appreciate the sentiment of this letter – the recognition of kindness and thoughtfulness that goes on in the schools because many of the adults who work there are loving human beings and because many of the kids come from loving homes (not always the case, but mostly).

        If someone wants to attribute that to God in the schools, there’s nothing wrong with that, even though I don’t looks to a god with capital G or believe Christ is our savior.

        Do believe that, unfortunately, many really good teachers are victims of a system that doesn’t allow them to be as creative as they really are, that demands high test scores as a form of accountability when there are so many other wonderful and important things that kids could and should learn.

        I am grateful for the human beings that took care of the kids in Newton during and after the shooting. Wonderful, awesome examples of giving, loving human beings.

      • Testify, Holly! The math and science required by college applicants these days shows how far education has advanced since the 70s, when I was in high school. To get into a competitive college back then, you only needed one year of a lab science and three years of math. Now, for most state and private colleges, you need at least three years of a lab science, four years of math, and preferably AP Calculus or a couple of science APs as your starting point. The math and science my kids learned in high school are literally incomprehensible to me. –Which reminds me of another thing about many schools in the 1970s: girls weren’t really expected to master math and science.
        .

    • The thing is, Brandon, in the past public e3ducation was not under constant derision from religious extremists – that’s right, extremists who want to make everyone bleat out professions of being Christian, as well as capitalists wanting to make a buck by privatizing everything so that those who can afford to get fleeced will pay and pay while those less fortunate will stay less fortunate. No olne ever “took God out of school”. We simply quit forcing a narrow idea of God on everyone, thereby providing true Freedom Of Worship. Get a clue.

    • Brandon. I agree with you. God is an utter failure. He took a loaded gun, fully aware of his children’s actions, and placed it in a room where they played and told them not to touch it (in the form of the Tree of Knowledge of Good and Evil) but gave his innocent infants free will, just like the kindergarten students had free will to go to school that day…he killed his children (separation from God) and made Satan his business partner. He was an utter failure as a parent in that he tempted his children with deadly consequences and he failed to prevent the serpent from bringing harm to his children. He utterly failed to protect the children in school as another child with an assault rifle murdered them. God is so weak that we can wish him away without thinking of our actions. God is a failure. God is a sad, megalomaniac that is so insure of his divinity as to create us to constantly remind him that he is God and that if we fail to do so, will be tortured forever. God is an utter failure. I agree with you. remind him that he is God

      • But that’s ridiculous. If you have children, you know that there are certain rooms you don’t want them to go, certain things they are not allowed to touch, because they’re dangerous. Is a parent an utter failure if his/her children are willfully disobedient and bring harm to themselves? If I tell my daughter not to run, and she runs anyway and falls and scrapes her knee, am I then to be called a failure?

    • Atheists can be moral people. I see it all the time and they are everywhere.

      And some religious people are amoral. Some even stoop so low as to make up facts to prove a point they couldn’t manage to debate without lying.

      • Well that’s a true statement and the voice of reason. But read through the many comments. Why are atheists so angry all the time? Don’t believe in God, that’s up to you, but don’t call me an idiot for taking comfort in my faith. What’s with these folks?

    • @Brandon- In our school, we have a moment of silence after the Pledge. And yes, God is still in the Pledge to the flag. Because we are a government entity, we refrain from advocating any particular religion. We shoot for life lessons and basic morality. The schools have been “dumbed down” in the last 50 years because the polititians all have an agenda and have legislated that we teach all kinds of things that weren’t taught when I went to school. On top of this, when I was a kid, most mothers stayed home and raised their kids, and most kids were taught to be diligent and polite at home. They also were taught to eat properly and were urged to go outside to play. Parents also ensured that homework was finished, often helping their children to get it right. They learned about the birds and bees at home rather than at school. Teen pregnancy was present, but not visible because the girls went off somewhere to have their baby. All of these lessons learned at home are now delegated to the schools. In between standardized tests that push their own agenda, we finally get a little time to teach the basics. The only reason private schools look better is because they can choose who attends them, and they aren’t subject to the whims of the State Board of Ed. They don’t have mandated inclusion of learning support kids who may or may not have passed any prerequisite courses. They don’t have students who can’t speak English. Their students can afford the tuition, so they are not the economically disadvantaged students we have in our school, who may not have eaten breakfast or possibly dinner the night before. If you really are concerned about the state of our education system, please go to the nearest school, get all your background checks, and volunteer to help out. It’s a guaranteed eye-opener.

    • Honestly, you think that a person with damaged psychological capacity only needs to read “thou shalt not kill” and everything will be fine? That person would smack himself on the forehead and say, “Oh yeah, no killing! What was I thinking?”

      How I wish life had such simple solutions. But you’re living in a fairytale if you think reading the ten commandments is all it takes to make a perfect society.

    • You’re right. Schools taught me about Santa Claus and the Easter Bunny. When I grew up to be an adult, I learned they didn’t exist. Screw the education system because they lie about the Easter Bunny!!!

      I want to go back to 1962 too. Don’t have to share the school with “black people” and we can freely learn about joining the KKK and ensure gays are burned and beaten.

      Pre-1962 was such a fabulous time, who wouldn’t want to go back!

      (*please note the sarcasm and ::facepalm:: I am doing from Brandon’s dumb comment.)

    • So Brandon, are you saying that YOUR moraility should be the “brand” taught? Or, how about mine? How about a Jew’s? Or a Muslim’s? Or a Wiccian? Your post, just like Mike Huckabee, just makes no sense. Everyone EXCEPT you, knows exactly why Huchabee is saying the things he is saying!

  69. Pingback: Dear Mr. Huckabee: Finding God's presence in school

  70. The fallacy in PTA mom’s presentation is that Huckaby (of whom I am not particularly fond) wasn’t slamming teachers or schools. He was actually commenting on society’s direction. Its not the school nor the teachers who ‘remove’ God from schools. Glorifying unions just doesn’t fit here. If you want to rant about something in the wake of a tragedy, find a REAL ‘enemy’ or bad guy. Its not Huckaby nor teachers nor schools. Since we can’t identify the ‘bad’ guy…pick on innocent people trying to understand such evil from their particular frame of reference. I think one of the policemen on that day publicly asked everyone to pray in passing. Why don’t we beat up on him for such a misplaced effort to comfort?

    • So agree with you Phyllnadra! I’ve been reading all of these comments and am disgusted with the majority of them from both angles. We wonder why there is evil in this world? I see hate not LOVE in the many of the comments trying to prove a point. Folks…….the answer is Love! I think if we all thought about LOVE the next time we interact with others or make a decision…….our words and actions would have more positive rippling affects on this world.

  71. Pingback: Your Doomsday Preparations Are Killing Us « vegasjessie

  72. This idea of a vengeful God who is pacified by our prayers but not before a game of ‘cat and mouse’ has got to stop. It’s no wonder there are so many horrible acts carried out by confused humans… You don’t bite the hand that feeds? Well, you shouldn’t riddle your toddler with dangerous trap doors and mind games either.

    People wonder how someone could do such a thing… Well, apparently it’s something that the Christian God would do. Read your bible, God used to do this kinda stuff all the time. Can you blame someone for trying to be more like Him? … … … I can.

    • I think we should make Spider-Man our god. Here’s why:

      1. He allows free will, yet that isn’t a cop-out when we need him.

      2. He allows people to slander and defame him without retribution, yet he is still always there when the slanderers and defamers need him.

      3. He doesn’t require worship. He takes care of us simply because he can and he is good.

      4. He doesn’t ask for money, dress in expensive suits, or live in million dollar homes. “Action is his reward.”

      Now, two serious points:

      1. Those heroic teachers were acting in the Spider-Man model, not the Christian god model. They were THERE when needed, and put their lives on the lines for their students. If they were acting in Mike Huckabee’s model of god, they would have apparently turned their backs on the kids because the kids didn’t respect them enough.

      2. Marvel comics are fiction and you may think my Spider-Man comments are silly. To many people, your books are just as fictional and the stories of Genesis, immaculate conception, etc., are just as silly as the stories of Spider-Man. We don’t want your mythology being confused with education and we don’t want our children worshipping your versions of Spider-Man any more than you want your kids to worship a comic-book character. The reason for removing religion from schools is because it doesn’t belong there, except in courses on mythology. It is an intellectual decision, not a moral decision.

      To all of you who believe in a religious god, I ask you to question why your god deserves to be worshipped, other than it says so in the guide book.

      • God requires nothing from us other than faith. In fact you make Mr. Huckabee’s point for him. I did not want my children being taught ANY religion outside of that which I chose for them. When they became adults they had the free will to do as they chose. Even my faith has waned over the years at times. that doesn’t mean you are right or I am wrong. What it means is that people of any religious faith have the right to express their views just as much as those who do not choose to have that faith. Mr. Huckabee spoke about the deterioration of the culture from his point of view. You disagree and that is fine. But let us be very clear. The founders of this country -right wrong or indifferent- had a judeo-christian background. They sought to build a government that would not infringe on the rights of any of its citizens. Go back and read the Declaration of Independence. God is all over it. the bill of rights started out as ten amendments. It is odd that they would choose such a number or do you think they were thinking of the Ten commandments? I don’t know because I wasn’t there and maybe you were and just don’t remember. The constitution was designed to protect us from the government. Read it! Its right there. The government needs to stop “protecting us” because it violates the constitution.

      • A note to KH. You are wrong. “God” is mentioned only four times in the Declaration of Independence. God is not all over it.

      • It says so in the guide book.
        I am a Christian, You athiests are going to Hell. Good riddance. Your cerebral rantings and your feminism progressive evolution muck is the reason for your stupidity. You pat yourself on the back when you collective beat up the Christian point of view. You hold hands and follow Satan’s lies to the tee. Your highest wisdom is laffable. You kill babies and act offended by the likes of Casey Anthony. I for one don’t suffer fools lightly. I know the difference between right and wrong. I am smarter than any athiest. Jesus is Lord. Those other religons are lies. I am smarter than all my teachers. Have a nice day.

      • Mr. Hicks:

        Assuming your post isn’t a joke:

        You’re aware, aren’t you, that Thomas Jefferson didn’t believe in the divinity of Christ? And that he wrote, of religion, that it was “a subject on which I have ever been most scrupulously reserved. I have considered it as a matter between every man and his maker, in which no other, & far less the public, had a right to intermeddle”?

        And that in John Adams’s administration, the Senate ratified the Treaty of Peace and Friendship, which states in Article XI that “the government of the United States of America is not in any sense founded on the Christian Religion”?

        And that in “The Age of Reason,” Thomas Paine said, “I do not believe in the creed professed by the Jewish church, by the Roman church, by the Greek church, by the Turkish church, by the Protestant church, nor by any church that I know of…Each of those churches accuse the other of unbelief; and for my own part, I disbelieve them all”?

        …Good. I thought so. Just so you know, I’m a practicing Christian and have just enrolled in the University of the South’s “Education for Ministry” program. But we feminist progressive evolution baby-killing muckers like to make sure of our facts before we spew out the kind of anger you just did.

      • Way to go Terry Hicks, you just associated your narrow-minded and bigoted perspective with disdain for women. What a treat you are.

        Bring on your satan. I’m invincible. Imaginary demons can’t prey on people who don’t believe in imaginary beings. You however, are prey for your imaginary demon because you believe in it. Satan is coming for you, Terry Hicks. He is entering your mind as you read this.

        You are a religious drone. Your path to freedom and salvation is to simply grow up and start thinking for yourself instead of being a slave to the christian dogma.

  73. Pingback: One Letter We Must Read | Desert Beacon

  74. Wow. This article couldn’t be more “spot-on.” Mr. Huckabee is a classic case of someone who values the “letter of the law” much more than the “spirit of the law.” Sure, reading the Bible, praying, going to church, are all things God and Jesus taught us to do. However, these are all simply a means to a greater end. These “tools” are supposed to support us in furthering God’s work through actions such as the ones demonstrated by teachers every day. The many examples listed in the article ranging from serving the homeless, to acting as a shield for a child while bullets are fired, are perfect examples of what God taught and offer indisputable proof that he has not left our schools. Huckabee obviously doesn’t get the big picture.

    • I wholeheartedly agree with both the writer of the letter and to your response. As a public school educator and a former Sunday School teacher, I would rather walk out my faith through deeds and actions than to publicly display it by Bible thumping and public prayer. I constantly remind many of my fellow believers that we are not saved by our works alone, but by grace and mercy. We demonstrate that mercy when we treat others with kindness. We were warned that public prayer is not what God expects. We were told to go to our secret places. These conservative right wingers have forgotten this.

  75. Wow, can you take comments anymore out of context? Huckabee prefaced his comments by saying when people ask him “where was God”. He didn’t say it was caused by this removal, he said that God won’t prevent it when we remove him from out lives.

    • God won’t, by choice, prevent free will. Self determination with readily available counsel is a gift of Love.
      We are the ones now responsible for what is ‘allowed’ or not. (Don’t be surprised at the internal rejection of that idea! It’s natural.)

      • So all would have been cool if Adam and Eve wouldn’t have disobeyed God? God already knew the outcome and killed his children instead of the serpent. God is a sad, weak, evil, demented, selfish, megalomaniac that is more human than God. Only God could have been created in the image of man because that is how God acts…like a childish human.

    • So by not reciting a specific version of the praises of God, God would not prevent the attack and thus the kids deserved to die? Can’t have it both ways.

    • Jared, what does that context add to the conversation? How does it make his comments any less insensitive or poorly timed?

    • I’ve actually listened to Huckabee’s remarks. There’s nothing out-of-context about what this writer writes. Huckabee should have apologized and called it a bone-headed moment, instead of doubling down and calling himself a victim of the godless left. Jared, you are putting a kind interpretation on Huckabee’s statement that they do not bear. It’s good to be kind, but not in order to accuse someone else of being unfair, as you do.

      • He was appealing to his righteous, hateful, fear-mongering nutcases who would love to have this tragedy focused on the convenient scapegoat of “lib’uls”, instead of a careless Mom tragically giving her mentally ill son gun lessons. And we still don’t know what pharmacology was driving his crazed mind.

    • You think that helps? The church has a special day (All Saints Day) to remember all the martyrs. Did God refuse to protect them because they removed him [sic] from their lives? Huckabee has a simplistic and pretty unhelpful theology.

    • Jared, are you saying that NOT ONE of those people that were killed were christain? If they WERE, then please ask Mr. Huckabee why THEY were killed? Of course, the answer is, because God had nothing to do with it. But, based on what I have heard, and seen, Mike Huckabee is a fan of Fred Phelps, and so are the people that agree with him. I don’t see how it could be any other way.

  76. Are parents held accountable for anything anymore? Everything is about school, what is taught in school, what is not taught in school…What about the things going on at home? The first teacher a child has is their parent. Parents have zero accountability or responsibility.

    • You are so right that parents have little, if any, accountability or responsibility with the education or the results of educating their children.

    • Yes, you’re right that it all needs to start with the parent. However, that is beside the point of this article and a different debate altogether. The purpose of this article is to point out that “God” hasn’t left our schools even if “we” have removed many of the traditional elements of religion from the institutions such as prayer, the bible, etc.

    • I fully support parent accountability regarding our children’s education. But as a parent I have encountered more than one lazy teacher who blamed all of the problem on parents. When I showed up & took responsibility for the part I needed to, those teachers had no idea what to do. I realize I’m talking about a minority of teachers but the majority of parents want to do the right thing for their children too. There has to be shared accountability. Sorry, I realize this is off topic but I had to weigh in on this “parents are to blame” theme.

    • Like God the parent that took his children to the garden, tempted them with a deadly choice, then let them suffer. ADAM AND EVE WERE CHILDREN!!!!!!! Just as if he had placed a loaded gun in a room of two-year-olds and said, “Don’t touch it!” Kill your children for not listening and make the snake pervert your business partner…what a great parent!

  77. OK, so now he’s backpedaling and saying he didn’t mean prayer in school would have stopped the Newton school shootings, but that we’ve removed God from our lives.

    Well, whose fault it that really, Rev. Huckabee? Is it us “vile and vicious” folks from “the predictable left,” or is it the failure of you and others like you to live up to what the founder of your religion said in Matthew 22:36-40?

    • Huckabee is vile and vicious and a false Christian just like most holier than thou Republicans who ignore the teachings of Jesus and side with the moneychangers, the idol worshippers and the lunatics who pervert the words of the Bible for their twisted non-values.

    • Thats not what he said you idiot. He responded to a question someone asked him “why didnt God stop this?” Go read his actual post on Facebook and educate yourself. He never said it would’ve stopped the school shootings, he said it because its a perfect response to the hypocrisy of left wingers. They try so hard to remove all parts of God out of schools… and then have the gall to ask “why didnt God prevent this?”.

      Good lord, educate yourself.

      • So Mr. Ajent OranjeNick with the offensive avatar insulting our President, why would you expect anyone of decency to value your opinion? And then you call people ‘idiot.’ Nice, especially in a discussion about prayers. You only reinforce the perception that I and many others have about people who practice the Fox News brand of Christianity. Which is that I want to keep you as far away as possible from educating the children I know about God.

  78. No, no, no, no, no. I was a Christian teacher in a public school for many years and many times admonished for it. Yes, Jesus still loves through those who love Him, but to indicate that everyone in the schools lives loves as He does is wrong. I witnessed a Kindergarten teacher put students’ desk in the corner for a WHOLE day… this is God you say? No. Your statements are from an outsider.

      • There are hateful people in every profession. There are those who get into teaching and have no business being there. However, the words she is speaking have a great amount of truth and for you to say otherwise is ignorant. There are evil people, and yes some are teachers but I’ve seen greatness, love, kindness. Many of those horrible teachers preach the utmost faith. It isn’t what you preach, it is what you practice. If God is not in your heart and violence is in your home, it will make its way into the school. State sponsored prayer is not the solution. Recreating our culture and glorifying goodness over violence and hate is the real solution.

      • I can provide one outstanding example: the fourth grade teacher working across the hall from me stood in the hall and berated her students, in a voice that could be heard by all the students and teachers in the hall. She told them they should be in diapers because they weren’t paying attention. This is the year she won the popularity contest known as “Teacher of the Year” for the school.

    • And I’ve watched entire christian schools and evangelical home schooling parents teach children that the earth is only 6000 years old, that evolution is a lie, that adam and eve were the first humans, that dinosaurs were ridden by humans……so please tell me again why I should take your opinion as important??

      • You are painting all Christians with a pretty broad brush. There are many theological interpretations among Christians. I am a practicing Christian, and I do not believe that the earth is only 6000 years odld, or that evolution is a lie, or that adam and eve even existed, or that dinosaurs were ridden by humans. So there goes your stereotype.

      • Did you see me use the word “all”?? Man, christians are thin skinned. But shouldn’t our society call out as sham teaching religion as if it was science?

      • Ha! I love it!! You begin with scorning public education and public education teachers, then show your anger and thin skin when your “faith” is criticized. Just precious….your handle “LoveOneAnother” is as much of a sham as you and your god.

    • As a shy 5 year-old, a 45-minute bus ride away from the security of my home for the whole day, I was beaten in the ribs with a yardstick by a Nun because I was unable to hold back a sneeze during the morning parroting of the Lord’s Prayer. Your suggestion that Christianity is a major reason why some teachers love their students more than others is flawed, and was certainly NOT my experience.

      Overall, once I escaped the separate school system and entered the public school system, I had a very positive experience consistent with Ms Burkett’s post. I have some issues with Teacher’s unions, but overall I’m amazed at the job our teachers are doing under such trying circumstances. I would never have the patience to deal with many of today’s parents.

    • You witnessed ONE kindergarten teacher put a student’s desk in the corner – and you dismiss the entire profession?
      And why do you NEED to say you’re a Christian? Shouldn’t we be able to tell by your good works and care for those less fortunate?
      Rubbish.

    • As a Christain there are many wonderful people who are not Christian. I am so frustrated on both side seen people do thing they say in the name of GOD (ie Westboro Christians) I fear that being what my child being taught. However as a Christian I believe God is with us and our Innocent Children it may not alway be in my undertstanding why he does as he does. Parents of all children need to be involved and truely see what we teach them at home needs to be stronge instilled. GOD BLESS

    • The same God that cursed a fig tree for not bearing fruit out of season? For tempting his innocent children in the Garden? For killing us for not wishing to feed his megalomania? That God?

    • No, no, no, no, no, yourself.

      You were admonished not because you are a Christian– as you claim in order to deceive– but because you were endorsing your religion in school, in contradiction to the freedom of religion of Jews, Muslims, atheists, agnostics, Hindus, Shintos, and Christians who do not believe exactly as you do. If you were not endorsing your religion in school, no one would even know that you are a Christian and thus no one would know to “admonish you for being a Christian.”

      “I witnessed a Kindergarten teacher put students’ desk in the corner for a WHOLE day… this is God you say?” Firstly, what caused the teacher to put the child’s desk in the corner all day. Did the child suffer because his desk was in the corner? And what does that have to do with “God?”

      God doesn’t like people who bear false witness and you just bore false witness against EVERY person who admonished you, about yourself by lying about the reasons for which you were admonished, about the author of this piece, AND against every Christian in that school who did not proselytize as you did.

      If God is in your heart and you heart is in the school, God is in the school. You blaspheme by denying that.

      Your statement is from someone who has no faith.

  79. I imagine the teachers and little children called out in desperation to god to help them in that horrible situation. Only a vengeful and hateful ‘god’ would allow innocent babies to be systematically executed by a madman because we ‘kicked him out of the schools’, or because of violent video games.
    Mental illness and access to military style weapons caused this tragedy.

  80. Pingback: An Open Letter from an Atheist to a PTA mom | Reason With Me

  81. I am always surprised how someone can misinterpret another’s point of view and make a war out of a heart felt concern. My daughter was asked, in a public school classroom, by a teacher if she really believes the Bible is true. And, he continued to denounce the authenticity of her and other students faith. She stood up for her beliefs and the truth. She relayed this too another teacher and said she wanted to speak with the principle of the school about the conversation. This teacher said, ” good thing you didn’t do that, you would have gotten in big trouble. The student handbook says you are not allow to discuss your religious beliefs with a teacher”. I am not sure that is a policy, although, I wouldn’t doubt it. However, that fact that a teacher is ridiculing students for their faith in God is insane. It’s naive to believe that our society is not trying to remove God from public institutions. We are not a Muslim country or any other country. We invite all belief into the nation. However, we are a country founded on Judeo-Christian beliefs. No one is forced to accept that religion as their own. But, to continue to be told that we need to accept all religions undermines the foundation of this country. Yes, God presence is in our schools through the body of Christ, which is people that are followers of Him. Thank goodness. Look at countries where Christian values are removed or non-existent, you will find poverty, chaos, disrespect and VIOLENCE. To Mr. Huckabee’s point, we have removed those values, not people, but core values that we once held close as Americans. The good in America is from the people that have the love of God in their hearts and care about others. I am not asking any public institution to propagate or educate Christianity. But, to continually brush it aside as another religious annoyance or condemn it as intolerant will change the the outcome of our present and future generation. Your opinion is noted, but in your desire to level the playing field, so to speak, you are making a statement about God and His place in America. My heart grieves not only for the parents and families of this horrible tragedy. But, for a country that will continue to see the affects of “one nation NO LONGER under God”.

    • Your god let those children perish. There is no denying that. He not only allowed them be slaughtered, but he heard their awful cries of “Save me, Jesus” and did nothing.

      But I’m sure you will comfort yourself in thinking “The lord works in mysterious ways.”

      Does that comfort you?

      • There is a matter of free will among us all. So many times people blame God when things happen, but the fact is human behavior is to blame. God was there. Our society is full of wickedness and that is a fact. The only way God can get rid of it all is to destroy the wicked people again. Is that what you want? God is called on when ever bad things happen, but when life is going good he is not thanked reguraly by everyone. To us we morn and are sad over the loss, because we cannot hold them or talk to them…to God they we are always alive. Our bodies may die, but we still live. We are either alive on Earth or alive in Heaven. My prayers are with those who lost love ones to this wicked man, and I hope they can find comfort in our loving God. He has their love one in His kingdom, and someday they will see them again. I have loss many people close to me, but do not blame God for any of the loss. I blame this wicked world that is full of wicked people and disease. I will keep you also in my prayers that your hurt will not harden your heart so that you cannot see the truth.

      • To WakeUpHadEnough, what comforts you? I believe God can do anything. As human beings living in the “land of the free” we make choices. I choose to be a born again christian, be married, work at a public university, and vote republican. What comforts you?

      • Lisa…I choose to believe in reality. I left behind my beliefs in faeries and gnomes and unicorns and Santa oh so long ago. I am constantly amazed at science and nature and the universe. My amazement comes from both learning more and more and also from knowing that there is so much TO learn. I am comforted by my family and friends and so often by myself in my own way and time. I’ve chosen to not hold onto myths and legends as facts and reality. When that happened to me, I was truly FREE!!

        And I’ve studied, gotten degrees, work at a charter school and consider myself a proud progressive democratic socialist!!!

      • Obviously you have no clue about Christian theology. Those comments you make have been rehashed on the Internet thousands of times. You’re only parroting what you’ve been told – which is what you accuse Christians of doing, isn’t it?

      • WeAreNotAllTheSame…..what did I get wrong? While there are indeed different denominations, and of course individuals can and often do pick and choose how to categorize their beliefs, there is little disagreement on most of the basics of christianity. If my characterization of christian belief does fit yours, so be it. But that same characterization fits MILLIONS of christians.

    • The original inhabitants of this country were Native Americans and they have never nor would they ever expect those who migrated here to accept their beliefs. This is not and never has been a Christian nation. PBS had a good documentary last night showing that inly one person, Benjamin Franklin wanted to include any aspect of religion in the original constitution and all others voted against it. The reason the Pilgrims left England was because they wanted to keep the Sabbath, on the seventh day and the Church of England was trying to enforce Sunday worship. They wanted the freedom to keep the seventh day. Prayers are still said in schools. And some even hold a bible study for students who want to attend, during the lunch period. I know. My brother-in-law was an ordained minister who led one in the school he taught at with no problems from anyone. That being said, I believe in the separation of church and state because Jesus taught it. Read the book to see. You cannot dictate faith, yours or anothers to any other person nor can you legislate it. It is a private thing between you and your Creator. Jesus even spoke against loud prayers in public places and said we should go into our closets to pray, where God who sees in secret would reward us openly. Whose religion would you have taught? And by the way, religion is NOT of God anyway. It was all man’s idea which is why you find so many different denominations who all believe varying things. Jesus made it clear what His true followers would be and do…keep the ten commandments, feed and clothe others, love your neighbor as yourself. I agree there needs to be gun control. God didn’t give you the right to bear arms. That was man’s idea and why? Because at that time, they were still settling into territory yet unknown, and most everyone hunted for food or wanted to drive out the Native Americans. Be honest. Do you need to hunt for your food??? Jesus said, ‘if you love Me, keep My commandments’, and when the young ruler asked Him which, he recited the ten commandments, then consolidated the ten into what He called the two great commandments. They were never ‘hung on the cross’, as Mr Huckabee’s church might teach. Jesus kept them as did His followers do up to this day. And Jesus also said’ why call Me Lord, Lord and do NOT the things I say?” People need to examine why they believe what they do and then just study what the Bible teaches, not simply believe what grandma did or some preacher who doesn’t know any more than they do.

    • Excellent example of exactly the point I was trying to make. Thank you for that validation. It is difficult to be the lone voice in the chaos, warning of impending doom. Neither I nor you, I think, are trying to be overly negative. But a sense of honest, open-eyed realism about the current state of our country and our schools would benefit our students and our society.
      As an educator, I’d like to apologize for the ills your child has suffered and recognize that that teacher and the response from the administration was wrong. Thank you for being the kind of parent who is involved and has taught your child values at home instead of expecting the school system to both educate and parent your child, as is so common.
      I agree with your post whole-heartedly.

    • Just a couple of things.

      On a “Christian Nation”:

      “The Government of the United States of America is not, in any sense, founded on the Christian religion.” President Adams, 1797 treaty with the Barbary Pirates

      …Christians were well represented when this country was founded, but unfortunately the United States was not founded on Christianity. Much more concrete information like the above if you are ever interested in reading. Sorry, your one fiction book does not cancel out hundreds of history books.

      On “Look at countries where Christian values are removed or non-existent, you will find poverty, chaos, disrespect and VIOLENCE” :

      In Japan, where Christianity is the minority and receives zero recognition from the government other than the right to practice, in 2008 the country had 11, as in one less than a dozen, deaths from guns. (And to note, Japan also has lower poverty levels than the US, although both are not great).

      In America approximately 73% identify as Christian, with the public worship and displays from government institutions, while declining, still very much on display. That same year we had 12,000 gun-related murders. Either a) Your god is more tolerant to Japan even though they don’t care about him. b) Your god is just an as*hole to Americans, or c) Your interpretation of religion and hypocrisy may actually be part of the problem, exactly what this article you didn’t fully read was trying to convey.

    • The good in America is from the people that have the love of God in their hearts and care about others.
      Flag says: No one has to have the love of God to care about others. The two do not go together.

    • “Look at countries where Christian values are removed or non-existent, you will find poverty, chaos, disrespect and VIOLENCE.”

      You mean like Sweden, Denmark, Norway, and Japan?

      • To Russell Kersey, Christians used to do that, too. Lady Jane Grey was beheaded by Queen Mary of England because she didn’t believe ‘the right way’ about Jesus. I certainly don’t approve of what they do in the Middle East, but Christians have a lot to be ashamed of in their history, too.

    • People will continue to “brush [Christianity] aside as another religious annoyance” as long as people like you insist on defining as “Christian” those values that are common to virtually all religions and to many secular philosophers, such as the principles this country was founded on..

    • I was rediculed by a teacher for my beliefs as a Christian and this was in 1977. I did not let it effect me. I continued to share my faith with other students.

    • Thank you, Becky for a thoughtful, fair and accurate outline of the subject at hand. Many posters from both sides of the religion question have posted vile and untrue statements in this discussion. You cannot describe God or Christians, by randomly quoting individual bible verses that you have read, or have heard repeated by others that share your beliefs; or lack of belief.
      According to some of the posters, you cannot believe in God, unless he guarantees and provides a perfect world, with perfect citizens and wonderful outcomes of every circumstance.
      An argument made in a loud and hateful manner will always solicit a loud and hateful response, but an argument made with love, compassion and empathy will only solicit responses of the same.
      To paraphrase Cardinal Dolan; If you don’t know what to say, then your tears and silent presence can be very elequant.

    • Yes, yes, and how did this come up exactly?

      Your point would be valid if the teacher did this without cause, but I suspect that what actually happened is that your child contradicted a teacher on science or history based on Bible teachings. For instance, in science class by claiming that evolution is a lie or that people did not exist 6000 years ago because God hadn’t made the world yet. The PROPER response to such dialogue from a child in science class is to CORRECT her by stating the FACTS in question.

      To people who argue creationism as science, this would be considered “denounce the authenticity of her and other students faith.”

      You don’t get to decide what “truth” is and if you believe that your religion is truth, that’s because you don’t understand faith.

      I am tired of people lying to claim discrimination where there is none, in order to get away with forcing their religion on others.

  82. Some valid points are made, but in general it misrepresents Huckabee’s actual position. Here are his words:

    “It’s far more than just taking prayer or Bible reading out of the schools. It’s the fact that people sue a city so we aren’t confronted with a manger scene or a Christmas carol. That lawsuits are filed to remove a cross that’s a memorial to fallen soldiers. Churches and Christian-owned businesses are told to surrender their values under the edict of government orders to provide tax-funded abortions pills. We carefully and intentionally stop saying things are sinful. We call them ‘disorders.’ Sometimes, we even say they’re normal. And to get to where that we have to abandon bedrock moral truths, then we’ll ask well, where was God.

    “And I respond that, as I see it, we’ve escorted him right out of our culture and we’ve marched him off the public square and then we express our surprise that a culture without him actually reflects what it’s become. As soon as the tragedy unfolded, I think God did show up. He showed up in the lives of teachers who put their lives between a gunman and their students. He showed up in policemen who rushed into the school not knowing if they would be met with a barrage of bullets. He showed up in the form of hugs and tears for children, parents and teachers who would live through the slaughter. He showed up at the overflowed church services where people lit candles and prayed. And he showed up at the White House where the president invoked His name and quoted from His book…”

    • So after centuries of Christian persecution, torture, expulsion, and murder of Jews, Huckabee thinks a cross is supposed to be a “memorial” to a fallen Jewish soldier? Would a Taliban flag be a fitting memorial to an American soldier killed in Afghanistan?

      So Huckabee thinks Christian-owned businesses get to dictate the religious beliefs of people who work for them?

      Does Huckabee think that the “teachers who put their lives between a gunman and their students” did so because someone propagated his religion in their public schools when they were students?

      Please stop defending Huckabee!

      • I would offer that Huckabee doesn’t think… Logic has no place on the pro-Christianity side of an argument. They have fear, tradition, passion, and faith as their tools, so they don’t need to “think”. If they really did think, they would realize how their beliefs are loaded with hypocrisy and are not based on fact.

  83. Jerry Falwell told us that homosexuality caused the 9/11 attacks. Pat Robertson said abortion caused Hurricane Katrina. Now, Mike Hucksterbee blames the slaughter of 20 innocent children on the removal of prayer from schools. To the “christians” out there. I ask a question:

    Is your God so petty and petulant that he would allow the slaughter of children just to make a point? Is this the God of peace, justice and love? I guess so, since this all-knowing, all-seeing, omnipotent deity had to send his son to be tortured and murdered just to let the humans know that Heaven was open again. You people are truly twisted.

    • Excellent comment to an excellent letter from PTA Mom. How does God/Yawyeh/Great Spirit get cut down to such a whiny stick figure in so many whiny stick figure minds????

    • If you don’t believe what Huckabee (or Falwell, Robertson, etc.) says is true, why do you still assume his understanding of God is in any way accurate or theologically sound? That God actually operates in such a petty, fallible way?You can reject his reasoning for the tragedy, but you don’t deny the tragedy happened. Do the same for his bonkers, small-minded, unexamined, non-reflective view of God? Reject it as a terrible answer to a true reality.

  84. Let me tell you what else happens in public schools. Indoctrination, lies, political pandering, abuse of every form, disrespect flowing from student to student, student to adult, adult to student, and adult to adult. Compromise is another thing that happens every day. Teachers are forced to put up with giving ground on every issue from values and morals to educational integrity. I believe with my whole heart that most teachers are there because they want to help, but don’t for one second believe they’re all there under the guise of “doing God’s work.” The modern educational system is a joke, despite every effort on the well-meaning teachers’ parts, and has made our students a joke among the world’s educational peers. I walk the halls of my school every day and see the descent into lawlessness grow with every passing year. Mr. Huckabee’s statement was spot on. If we are not actively seeking God, then we are passively turning away from him. If we are not actively striving to uphold His law and his standards for us, then we are like a rock in the middle of a stream — passively allowing ourselves to be erroded by the forces around us. In time, we will look around and realize we have gone from a stallwart boulder of truth, to a tiny pebble that makes no more than a ripple of disturbance on the surface in our effort to protest evil. It is those who cannot see the truth in Mr. Huckabee’s words that are always the most shocked when evil takes it’s natural course. Come walk through the halls of my school. I’m sad to say, you wouldn’t have been nearly so surprised at the deplorable, evil deeds of that deeply, disturbed man in CT.

    • I have been fine with all of the comments and discussion on this post, however, I am bothered by the comment that public schools are places of “Indoctrination, lies, political pandering, abuse of every form, disrespect flowing from student to student, student to adult, adult to student, and adult to adult”. I am not sure where you work or what your experience is in public education but you are just flat wrong.

      I encourage you to read this post and rethink the powerful things that are actually happeing in schools, which is also one of the points in the current blog you have commented on, and understand that there is more to public education than the falsities you have written about today.–Dr. Jerry Burkett

      • To tell me I’m “flat wrong” is to discredit my experience every day for the last fifteen years. I CHOOSe to work in one of the roughest schools in one of the roughest school districts in this state. I never said that good things don’t happen. It’s the whole reason I work where I do – as an effort to bring order to chaos, education to those who have none, and hope to a generation I see being lost more every year.
        What I did say, however, was that to over-simplify what happens in these “hallowed halls” into just a bunch of well-meaning good deeds is to ignore the truth of what we educators face.
        What I am ready for, is for our society to take seriously the small compromises that happen every single day so that they don’t build and compound until they are giant, despicable acts of horror. It’s when we ignore the little things that they become something huge.
        I appreciate the positive things your wife had to say and kuddos to every educator out there who, like me, do try and bring a little of God’s hand into their classroom. However, when we blindly ignore the evil we face, we’re just sticking our heads in the sand and refusing to see what is in front of us. Unfortunately, we will reap, as these poor children and educators did in CT, the awful rewards. God help us all.

      • You never implied in your comment that good things do happen. You chose to speak about your experience of bad things happening. That was my point in saying you were “flat wrong”. If you choose to work in one of the roughest schools in state, then surely you are making good things happen yourself. As an educator, you should be speaking about those things first and foremost. I encourage you to talk about the good in our schools and correct the myth that “our schools are failing”. That is also flat wrong.

      • Well, just simply…my daughter can’t even ride to school on the bus without being assaulted with f-bombs the entire ride. Sexual inferences, foul language come at her every day. She tries to reach out and not judge others. But, again, your school may be unique, but you are naive if you don’t know about the drug usage/abuse and sexual promiscuity, disrespect for teachers and others. You might want to do more research.

      • I have to wonder if you and your wife ever read, or at least, comprehend what you are reading or just spout off? Your wife severely mis-represented what Huckabee said and then you follow up with a mis-representation of what the previous poster said. What is your “Doctorate” in? Obviously not reading comprehension. What is it with our “hero worship” culture? We worship soliders and we worship teachers. Let’s look at teachers, since you like to generalize your experience, I too will generalize. Most teachers come from the bottom 15-20% of their respective graduating classes. Most teachers take the job because they can’t really do much else. My son has had a mixed-bag of teachers. Of the 4, 1 was truly terrible, his current has been absolutely FANTASTIC and the other 2 were just there to babysit. You also neglect what other people think it means to be doing God’s work. I’m not particularly religious, but a lot of bible thumpers mean more than doing good deeds. Which it’s true that a lot of teachers do perform. But let’s be honest, most teachers, like most other profession are just there for the paycheck, regardless of how small it might be.

      • Why must I talk about the good first and foremost and not discuss the problems? That’s utterly ridiculous. I choose to do my job with blinders off.

      • Non-religious Man, where do you get your “facts” from? I’m going to assume that you get them from comics section of the newspaper or Fox News. If the school I teach in had the kind of teachers you describe, they would be out the door before their seat got warm. Also, I’ve served on numerous hiring committees and have seen many teacher transcripts, and I can assure you that they were not in the bottom 15% – 20% of their class. In my state there are admissions requirements in order to become a candidate for teaching which includes GPA standards.

        As a teacher, I take total offense to your statement that they become teachers because they can’t do much else. I, as well as many of my colleagues, have always felt that the teaching profession was a calling and not a last choice for careers. If your child attends school in conditions that you describe I would suggest that you challenge the district’s hiring practices and request stricter requirements for those who apply.

      • Well in a lot of ways in is telling the truth i have not been out of school that long and when i was in school u had student cussing out teacher’s and teacher’s putting there hand’s on student we even had a teacher student fight, and i was a student at one of the school’s that was shot up the by a student. Tj Soloman was the shooter of Heritage High School back in 99.

      • Sorry not trying to be rude but, why does it matter where i went to school haven’t u ever heard of typo’s, and why are u pointing out my flaw’s like ur so perfect. Wht don’t you do ur home work and look up Tj Soloman and maybe u will find the answer btw i didn’t know we were being graded for the way we type on here.

    • Then I supposed you’re not “An Experienced Educator” because you’re not effectively and efficiently doing your job to correct these ills in your school!

      • To ‘non-religious Dad’
        What an outrageous statement to say that teachers come from the bottom of their graduating classes. I am a teacher and I see how qualified my colleagues are. Most of us have graduate degrees and take CE all year long.
        Most of us are educators because we believe that an educated populace makes for a civilised society. You sound like a truly mean-spirited person who – like Mike Huckabee – believes we should all live according to your belief system. Open your mind and your heart and help to solve problems.

    • An Experienced Educator, I wonder whether you’re aware of the inevitable implications of Huckabee’s words. Do you believe that evil does not occur in places where God’s name is revered and praised? Are we to believe that if we all put God first we would not endure suffering? This world is broken, and it’s sinful, and it’s been that way since the Garden of Eden. What do you and Mike Huckabee think a good solution would be to the problem of “systematically eliminating God” from society? Should we fully endorse Christianity to the exclusion of Jews, Muslims, Buddhists, Sikhs, Hindus, and all others? Would that make a mentally ill psychopath think twice about shooting up a school? What’s your proposed solution? Do you honestly think we can by our own works and merit, “honor God” into rescuing us from all evil?

    • I have been teaching for 25 years, and I have never seen anything in my school that resembles yours. Perhaps this is a local issue and not a “God” issue. I refuse to believe that God would slaughter 20 innocent children because we no longer read Bible verses in school. I am from the same state as Mr. Huckabee, and I can tell you that as our governor, he had quite a few moments where he was very un-Godlike in his actions–primarily when he was taking money and gifts from sources that were unethical and borderline illegal. Apparently he must have forgotten about God while he was filling his pockets with money that was being funneled through hidden sources.

    • I too am troubled by the statement that public schools are places of indoctination, etc… Are we to believe that every school, every district is such a place? I know my 7 year old attends a school in which I have seen God at work. I have seen God work through her Kindergarten teacher who kneels at the classroom door each morning to give every child a hug and who ends every day the same way, sending her students off with a hug. I have no doubt that for some of the kids those will be the only hugs they will receive that day. I believe God has been at work in the conversations that I witnessed between teacher and student about values, about respect and relationships with each other, about non-violent resolution to disagreements and about how to communicate with respect. How did I see these things? Volunteering in the classroom and through the eyes of my daughter as she described her day.

      We are a country of many beliefs and religious traditions, many of the same people who call for “returning God to the classroom” are actually calling for a return of Chrisitianity to the classroom. My niece and nephew are Jewish, my family is Christian, I have friends who are Muslim – whose religion are we to represent? Doesn’t our constitutuion prohibit the government from establishing a mandatory religion and wouldn’t “returning God to the schools” infringe on the very right to religious freedom? We know what happens when our Muslim brothers and sisters seek to build a Mosque in some communities, or near Ground Zero in New York, protests and bias.

      God is at work in my daughter’s school. Is every teacher perfect? No, is any clergy or church perfect? no, that’s the nature of humans. I am so deeply moved by the sacrifices made by the teachers in Columbine, in New Town, and around this country. I am profoundly thankful for the men and women who commit their lives to teaching our children.

    • An Experienced Educator, I wonder whether you’re aware of the inevitable implications of Huckabee’s words. Do you believe that evil does not occur in places where God’s name is revered and praised? Are we to believe that if we all put God first we would not endure suffering? This world is broken, and it’s sinful, and it’s been that way since the Garden of Eden. What do you and Mike Huckabee think a good solution would be to the problem of “systematically eliminating God” from society? Should we fully endorse Christianity to the exclusion of Jews, Muslims, Buddhists, Sikhs, Hindus, and all others? Would that make a mentally ill psychopath think twice about shooting up a school? What’s your proposed solution? Do you honestly think we can by our own works and merit, “honor God” into rescuing us from all evil?

    • To An Experienced Educator:
      When you make statements of: If we are not actively seeking God, then we are passively turning away from him. If we are not actively striving to uphold His law and his standards for us, then we are like a rock in the middle of a stream — passively allowing ourselves to be erroded (sic) by the forces around us.
      I don’t feel you can possibly be an effective educator. It sounds more like you need to teach at a private, Christian school. That way – everyone in your classroom believes in your God & his rule book. All Americans do not – and all American children should not be told that they are evil if they don’t believe in the invisible sky monster. Especially when people like you & the Huckster tell them that this invisible sky monster allowed their fellow classmates to get shot & killed, simply because the 10 Commandments are not posted on the wall in every classroom and there is no Hail Mary after the morning pledge.
      People do not need to believe in your specific god to be good people. If you do not have the capacity to understand right & wrong, cannot feel empathy & compassion for others, and cannot follow the idea of treating others as you wish to be treated – then you’re a sociopath. No god, religion, book of rules, or molesting priest needed to understand those common human constructs.

    • Thank you for sharing your thoughts. I agree and especially like “If we are not actively seeking God, then we are passively turning away from him. If we are not actively striving to uphold His law and his standards for us, then we are like a rock in the middle of a stream — passively allowing ourselves to be erroded by the forces around us.” Becky

    • Angela, “u” are deliberately typing “u” instead of “you”, and are using apostrophes in your attempt at pluralizing. Therefore, these mistakes you are making intentionally are flaws in your writing, not typos (short for typographical errors). You are not being graded (perhaps you should be). However, if you want to be considered intelligent, with a valid point, then your writing should reflect that. Instead, your writing looks like a text message from a 5th-grader. That’s not how you want to be perceived, is it?

      I was serious when I asked where you went to school. Do you have a college education?

      • What dose it matter if I use “u” or “you” that’s like someone useing “2″ or “two”, You are the only one that seem’s to have a problem with it. Go back and reread the comment that i put and you will find you’r answer. I didn’t write anything out of text so why are you criticizng the way that I have wrote on here like a child. How about you grow up and stop gradeing the way people write. What if I was mentally challenged and didn’t know any better how would you know? Oh wait you don’t so before you start asking someone question’s about why there doing something why don’t you take a good long look in the mirror and ask yourself what you’r flaws are. Another thing why are you trying to get into my personal business it’s none of you’r business if i did or did not go to College. It’s sad that you are on here judgeing people by the way that they write when did you become God and who gave you the right to judge, or is it that you have nothing else better to do with you time except to point out people’s flaw’s. Big deal if i use “u” or “you” or “2″ or “two”. So with that being said go find someone else to judge and cratic. If u don’t like the way I type then don’t read.

  85. This is great! Unfortunately, politicians use events like this and religion to their own ends, thinking people less discerning will buy it. Kudos to you!

  86. As a teacher of 20 years and a young man who grew up in churches, sang in the choir and was a member of the Fellowship of Christian Athletes, I am fully supportive of keeping church and state separate. You can currently pray in public schools, you can have your bible on your hip, you can convene peers to study it if you like, you and access and reference the bible in literature and history. Students say the Pledge of Allegence across the country in public schools every day. That is plenty and the balance is good. But to infer that morality, values, kindness, peacefulness, justice are bastions of God and religion are plain ignorant, insensitive and dangerously dogmatic. Even the assumption that God IS supposed to be in our schools, whatever that means, and that we have the power to keep him in or out, seems incredibly rightious. Agreed, we have much to do to to make a peaceful culture, but God is not the answer for all and any pathway that assumes, “If…then…” over simplifies the argument. Thanks to both Mike and Kimberly for the dialogue that is at the heart of what allows us to be the great Nation we are!

    • I so agree, Chuck. I am retired after 33 years of teaching and know that God was present in my class every day as well as in many others. We need to all remember that God and religion are not the same thing. If I were to insist my students follow my public prayer, I am sure it would not meet the standards of Mike Huckabee and his cronies. So, even though I profess Christianity, it is not the same Christianity practiced by Mike Huckabee etc. This was an eloquently written article that should be read in churches and other places of worship.

    • Thank goodness in America we can agree or disagree and be allowed to do so! There may come a time when that is not the case! That would be another horrible tragedy!

    • KUDOS! I love the statement, “…that we have the power to keep him in or out, seems incredibly righteous.” Do people think schools have some kind of dome over our buildings that are barriers to God? Do people really and truly believe that if we were to go back to reading Bible verses over the intercom and leading the classes in prayer, that this would somehow solve all of the problems with violence? That would be a very naive and short-sighted way of thinking for sure.

    • Thank you Scotty for your reply. I am a social worker who has worked for the past 20 years with violent offenders, most of whom profess to be christians and talk about how Jesus works in their lives. There are people working every day against violence in our homes and schools. I am exhausted by the constant premise that somehow if you are not a christian you therefore cannot be for peace in our schools and society. There are many of us non-christians who have a non-violence belief system and all of our good work somehow gets diminished because we don’t fit into the spiritual norm. I cannot be open about my spiritual beliefs outside of my family and friend circles without someone saying my beliefs will send me to hell and I should change who and what I am and they will pray for me. My religion predates christianity by centuries, however it is no more right or wrong than any other belief system. I ask people to think about what they are saying when they make off the cuff remarks that one religion is the way to peace over another. Shouldn’t everyone’s goal to bring peace to our society? It is not what you profess but rather your actions that will change the world. Rather than letting religion divide us into an us vs. them mentality why don’t we choose to come together regardless of what your spiritual beliefs are.

  87. He did not say God was not in the school. He clearly was. Giving teachers the courage to put themselves in the line of fire to save the children, with those children and with first responders.. I know he was there quieting the spirits and giving peace to those babies that paid the price for that Satan driven monster;s actions. In the hearts of all the people that are doing everything they can to comfort the parents and survivng children. In the hearts of every human bieng across this country who feels there pain.. But MH is right we are headed for a Godless society.Anyone who does not believe that is fooling themselves. My 8 year old grandson wanted to put his bible in his backpack, not to force it on anyone else but to give himself comfort and was told he could not. Tell me what would it hurt. Who is to say that if the teachers and children had begun to openly praise God or recite the Lords Prayer it might have had some impact on this monster. We will never know because our children are taught that they have to keep quiet about God in school. As christian this troubles my heart. Christians need to stand up and be heard. If society can not see and hear God and his love in us we do not have a prayer..

    • Oh, my……(facepalm)…..you do realize that it very likely that many adults and children from the first shot heard, started pleading to their god to make it stop….how many of those INNOCENT little children that were slaughtered closed their eyes and asked your god to save them?? He DIDN’T save them….in fact,based on your belief, he chose to let his own creation, satan, rule the day and murder those innocent children.

      Please, people…..stop it.

    • Lisa T–Who told your grandson he could not take a Bible to school? i just received a voice mail from the principal of our local elementary school that “Bible club has been canceled this week.” They also had a play depicting the Birth of Christ, so we received another message that explained “because some of you don’t celebrate ‘like we do’ please write a note if you don’t want your child to watch the play about the birth of Christ, and we’ll be sure to exclude your child.” This in a public elementary school. Change seats with those of us who have beliefs other than the main stream, and try to remain calm while the dominant culture tells you they cannot practice their religion freely. you need to challenge your perspective because it is limiting you and it is making you feel bad for no reason. christians are in charge, and if you think otherwise, you are kidding yourself.

      This is a fantastic letter, and I wholeheartedly agree that teachers do God’s work every day and they are underappreciated, berated, belittled, and politicized. We can now add “take a bullet for your child” to the list of things a teachers do for the children of these United States.

      Otherwise, great letter

    • Lisa T, I’ve been a public school teacher for 7 years, and I happen to know that it is completely against the law (and TEA regulations) to tell students they can’t bring/read their bibles at school. It’s also illegal to make students “keep quiet about God” in public schools. Students are allowed to read their bibles, pray, and talk about God/Jesus any time they want to in every district in Texas. It’s TEACHERS that are not allowed to sponsor prayer or publicly endorse any particular religion at school, because they are required to love and respect ALL students the same regardless of their religious affiliations. That regulation, by the way, is there to protect children like your grandson from a teacher exposing him to, say, a Jewish or Muslim prayer. Would you want your grandson’s Hindu teacher to teach him about Lord Krishna or Vishnu? I thought not. How about your grandson’s Buddhist teacher forcing him to pray a Buddhist prayer every day? I thought not.

    • The problem is that he doesn’t want God…he only wants his interpretation of God. Your grandson should be allowed to put a Bible in his backpack but would you be as tolerant of the child who wants to carry the Koran? I’d believe those who want to be able to praise the Lord and recite the Lord’s Prayer (out loud since obviously you can say anything to yourself) if I believed you were willing to allow the same opportunities for those who believe differently.

  88. Just be good, tell the truth, and love as much as you can to as many as you can. Don’t attach it to the worship of talking snakes, demons, faeries, angels, Santa Claus, the Tooth fairy or any other supernatural, human made up god or gods. Such faith is misplaced and hollow.

  89. Kimberly Burkett has written a beautiful letter, and as a Texan, I agree there is a subtle message in our schools for the little children re God; she has not taken into account what will happen the next generation down. God has been removed in so many ways from our schools. She points out how the teachers, and principles are parenti to the children, (and they are). The next generation is doomed to repeat the only parenting they have learned from their parents…We already are reaping what has been sown in previous years by allowing the children to be taught it is ok to___. God has set standards and goals for each of us through HIS ten commandments. If they are not taught in the schools, then who will teach them? (their absentee parents) We are one nation under God. Children have been allowed to received a diluted education over the years…give a little here, give a little there, until they often, as adults, when asked to name ONE of our founding fathers, have no idea what you are talking about. Our founding fathers originated a document we could all live by, and they chose to acknowledge God… My personal belief is we do a great disservice by taking GOD out of our schools and the Pledge. We are a Judeo/Christian nation…or we were.

    • Hi Mary. Thank you for your post, illustrating that you completely missed the point. You and Huckabee would get along perfectly.

      • Chuck, good point, thanks for showing that there are some sane people in this world. I just wish fewer people believed in a wish granting sky daddy.

      • No, Matt, snark (or whatever characteristic you would ascribe to my response) is not what divides us. From where I sit, the biggest source of the divide are the beliefs held by some vocal Christians… that the US is a “Christian nation”; that Christianity is “under attack”; that the bible is an accurate historical document and is “the word of God”; that charity, kindness, and the like are “Christian values”; that the correct religion is Christianity and all others be damned; that the US should continue to give tax-exempt status to churches…

      • That’s true, BethE, and I agree that the US is not “a Christian nation,” but rather a nation in which many people of faith are Christians by choice, while others follow other paths. But the absence of the word “God” from the Constitution cannot be used to prove the intent of the Founders (and that’s relevant only if we assume that the intent of the Founders is significant for us today). The argument from silence is notoriously unreliable. After all, the word “food” is not in the Constitution, and yet we know that the Founders ate. The word “air” is not in the Constitution, and yet we know that the Founders breathed. The words “love,” “compassion,” and “hope” are not in the Constitution, but I certainly hope the Founders were familiar with these concepts and that they formed a meaningful parts of their lives.

      • Keith, sure, the absence of “God” from the Constitution can not prove all of the intent of the Founders. However… 1) It proves a lot of their intent, given that they were creating a country from a blank slate and had every opportunity to write as much Christianity into the Constitution as they chose, and 2) all of the Founders’ other writings show us exactly how they felt.

      • Actually, Keith, I was responding to Mary’s statement of “Our founding fathers originated a document we could all live by, and they chose to acknowledge God…” We were given the Constitution. It does not acknowledge God.
        I think that the writers of the Constitution were familiar with the concepts that you mention. Keith. They were also very familiar with the idea of leaving their original countries/allegiances to be able to worship in the manner that they chose. If they had chosen to create America as a Christian country, they would have said so in the Constitution. However, there’s the First Amendment with the freedom of religion, that the government and its representatives shall not endorse/give favor to any specific religion. Our freedom of speech and freedom of religion are two of the cornerstones of what made America different at a time when your government could very easily endorse and punish based on religion. I admire them for not wanting that nonsense to go on here and to respect the fact that not everyone worships the same way or even worships at all. I believe that their intent was to have our government be neutral (like not requiring a religious test for positions, the First Amendment, etc) on the question of religion and that government representatives should embody that.

      • BethE, you may have misunderstood me, or I may have been unclear. I was mainly try to demonstrate the difficulty of proving an argument from silence–i.e. the Founders don’t say anything about God, therefore they didn’t see a place for God in America–by citing examples of other things they didn’t mention: food, water, air.
        But I began by saying that I agree with those who say that America was not founded as a “Christian nation,” and it certainly is not a Christian nation now. I’m a Christian pastor, but I too am glad the Constitution mandates that our government remain absolutely neutral on questions of religion.

  90. A WONDERFUL letter that brought tears to my eyes. I am so thankful it is being shared on Facebook and I had the opportunity to read it. And thank you Kimberly Burkett – you spoke so eloquently for all the parents and grandparents that are tired of seeing our children suffer being used as pawns in political gaming. No where are we more sensitive to this deplorable behavior than in Wisconsin. And here too, God’s presence is felt – is seen – in the dedication of our educators.

  91. “God is a gentleman. He doesn’t go where He is not wanted.” That’s what I read…in disbelief. If anyone has been reared a Christian, they do know one of the first rules. GOD IS EVERYWHERE. He is in nature, in the schools, in the crack-house, in the prison, and even in the buildings we call churches. He was there with those babies just like He is there watching the dealings on Capital Hill when schools are the last to receive funding. If our Constitution is written in a way that prevents us from “talking” about God in our schools, then go to plan B. Teach about God at home and in in church. And let those kids and educators be shining beacons in these so-called dark places. Yes, schools all over are failing kids. But we Americans are to keep church and state separate. It is my firm belief that if mass prayer was still allowed at school, that our schools’ fates would be the same. Just because mass prayer is not allowed at school, it doesn’t mean that teachers and kids do not pray at school. And we parents and community members have fallen off the battle front also. This is the plan B I mentioned. When Paul & Silas were in jail, they prayed until the foundations shook. God was there, but they brought “rain”. If these politicians are truly serious about this, how many of them are right now organizing a community to us surround a particular school & pray outside until something shakes loose before something tragic happens? If you believe in the Devil, then you know this is exactly what he wants. In the confusion, we people cannot agree on what to do. So nothing gets done. The Devil gets away with it and goes on to something else. God is not a mere gentleman, GOD IS GOD. And He doesn’t just have a plan B(eta). He’s got it covered from Alpha to Omega. Why did He let the innocents get slaughtered? I don’t know. But we can ask Him when we get there maybe.

  92. Thank you for this. God is with me and my children every moment of every day. I have no doubt that others carry God with them each day as well, if that is what they desire. I do not want any authority telling me how or when I should express my faith – that would only belittle it. May we all learn from this horrific experience – learn that we are all parents and we travel together. We support each other with prayer and we do not all need to be cut from the same cloth. Our faith will grow and flourish when everyone brings their own voice to the mix and no child is told by a school authority how prayer “should” happen.

  93. You have twisted Mr Huckabee’s words and not represented his meaning. You can hardly deny the changing of American culture and the successful removal of God from it. Many schools are quite active in doing so, there is no singing of Away in a Manger, etc in my children’s “holiday concerts”. But schools were not the only aspect of his speech but all focused on the change in attitudes of American culture. I am not that old and grew up with acceptance of Christianity as part of American culture and it’s values were the core of our governments laws. It’s acceptance was hardly questioned let alone attacked. Growning up I don’t remember hearing of any of the brutal attacks we are experiencing now, do you? Is American culture the same as when you were young or has it changed in your eyes? Mr Huckabee’s observations are sound, just look around.

    • I’m not that old either, but I certainly don’t remember anyone singing “Chanukah, Oh Chanukah” at holiday concerts either. There’s a change in American culture that could be more inclusive, but I doubt it will happen either.

    • As a matter of fact, violence in American schools, as a whole, has lessened over the last 30 years. Most of that violence was from other students. I certainly remember days when getting beat up (and I’m a woman) happened all the time and was dismissed as “kids just being kids.”

      All through the 19th century, which was a very religious century in America, school teachers were endangered all over the country, esp. female teachers, from students. In the 1920s, in Michigan, someone blew up a school with peopl in it.

      If you never heard of violence in the schools, you either weren’t in a position to hear about it (or weren’t listening), or you like so many others suffer from a lack of history, whether from negligent teachers, overprotective parents, or news people who report the myth and not the reality.

      I’m over 60, and I remember days when Catholics and Jews were held to quotas in American organizations. I remember what it’s like to live in a society where only one religion is held up as the norm and considered “true.” Many American colonists were NOT Christian, or were the “wrong” sort of Christian, including our founders. Many colonists remembered clearly the days when European Christians killed each other for years over religion. That’s why there is no mention of God in our Constitution and why the Declaration of Independence only says Our Creator — which could be a Hindu creator, a Christian creator, a Jewish creator, a Buddhist creator, any religious creator.

      The Christian religion has much to its good credit. However, it like all other human activities, has much that is dark and horrible. Just being a Christian does not make a person, or a country, a good place to be. Non-Christians live in moral societies, too. People who don’t believe in the Judeo-Christian-Muslim god of the bible are moral, too.

  94. Lovely letter. The Christian Taliban like Mike Huckabee – those right wingers who are so wed to the rules of Christianity that they have completely missed the point of God’s love – have done more harm to Christianity than any supposed effort to keep God out of the schools. They are the modern day Pharasees. People are leaving the church not because they aren’t getting it forced on them in school but because of the mean-spirited hate-filled version of Christianity that folks like Huckabee put out there. I am Christian because I know God’s love not because it was forced down my throat. One chooses to be Christian. People like Huckabee want to remove that choice from us. That’s not faith. That is a theocracy.

  95. Well said. Thank you so much for these words.

    I find it so hypocritical to hear people preach that things like this happen because God has been removed from the schools and so on, when so many violent and vicious acts have happened in the name of God, by people who claim to believe in God.

    • Dear PTA MOM,
      I think that you were sincere in your response; but, unfortunately have completely misconstrued what mister Huckabee said. He most certainly was not blaming the teachers, or anyone for that matter. I urge you to read what he said again without any preconception… you may see what he said in a different light. To the others who will oppose anything or anyone that has, or speak the word God, or the Bible… well, that’s what you do: You’re in opposition to THE GOD OF THE BIBLE.

      • Francis,
        Unless you are willing to allow ALL religions EQUALLY, then religion has absolutely NO PLACE being taught in public schools. This is NOT the 18th Century, it’s the 21st and this country is DIVERSE in culture and RELIGIONS.

        Oh, and do you happen to remember the 1st Amendement of the US Constitution – Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.

        Or do people like you tend to overlook the Constitution when it suits you in order to dominate others?

        While YOUR god and Huckabee’s god may be YOUR god, it is NOT necessarily somone else’s God. Get over the fact that you and your kind are NOT the only ones who live in this country. Oh, and BTW, I’m Presbyterian.

        Remember the 1st Amendment to the US Constitution? Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion…

      • I think PTA mom is a mouthpiece for the union. Her piece focuses on the glorification of school personnel, not the tragedy, she is just full of bull. I am not into concerns about God in or out of school. I am not a member of any religion. PTA mom just is into condemning people of faith and promoting secular (union) causes. Go ahead and buy this baloney! LOL!

      • I’ll approve this comment and use this as an opportunity to remind everyone that PTA mom is exactly that…PTA mom. She is not a teacher, does not work for a union, and is a mouthpiece for no one except education, children, and her own child. Choose your words carefully or simply read the post again.

      • Just an FYI not every American subscribes to THE GOD OF THE BIBLE! It doesn’t make them terrible, godless people. It just means they have different beliefs and those do not include shooting up schools either. When I read about how we’ve forced God out of schools it sickens me to hear that it has to be YOUR God in order for it to be right. This is why we have freedom of religion in America!

    • To be fair, I did watch it. I watched it again at your suggestion to see if I had rushed to judgment. Sadly, I did not. The disclamers that Huckabee makes are totally obliterated by what he says. The single most significant point that this was a political move is in the fact that he was talking about it anyway. Who is he? A former paster, govenor, presidential candidate, and now talk show commentator. Other than the pastoral role, which he seems to enjoy keeping a toe in for political reasons, all of the former/current positions need something to keep him in the public eye. The very things that he attributes to God on this occasion are the things that on other
      occasions he says are not truly indications of God, or they are not sufficient indications. Why is it that a teacher putting herself in harms way the presence of God when loving them and teaching them daily is not? Huckabee talks of God as though He acquieses to our whims. God leaves when asked and shows up when needed. Then, maybe becasue he was asked, Huckabee becomes God’s voice of “nanny, nanny, boo, boo.” No Rich, what he says is right-wing-religious correct and it makes sense only in that context. As for condeming, he was condeming everyone who did not agree with him.

      • As I believe there is much good being carried on within the confins of schools everyday as a nation we do not acknowledge God and ‘openly’ allow Him to be taught in our schools as other religions and Gods are and that is what Mike is referring too…I have NOT heard him make any personal attack or suggest that there are not good and decent people working within schools to help others but that does not ADVANCE God’s Kingdom like openly praying in our schools and making sure the message is taught that God is the head of our nation and Jesus IS our Lord and Savior and THAT is what we promote in this country and if that is not your belief then you are more than welcome to take your family to a place where they beieve the way you do…you could be an athiest and stand in a food line or help a kid at school as you contribute to his march to hell….

      • Sherry, we do not have a theocracy in this country. Freedom of religion includes freedom *from* religion. If that’s what you want, you’re more than welcome to take your family to a place where they believe the way you do.

  96. A friend left this for me after reading the blog post I wrote on this very topic – but mine wasn’t directed specifically to Huckabee. It was in response to the trite little memes on social media about “Why weren’t you in my school… You won’t let me in.”

    My heart always lifts when I find others of similar opinions to my own – finding commonalities is important.

    Thank you for this post. If you’re interested in reading mine, visit my blog.

  97. Where there are good things it doesn’t always means God is there. The Bible tells us that Satan can appear as an Angel of Light, can perform miracles and other good deeds to deceive us. It’s sad to know that in spite of this horrific carnage and warning from God, men still hold on to their arrogance and pride.

    • Yes, they do. Mike Huckabee certainly is clinging to his pride and arrogance. Satan appears most of all where someone is selling you Christianity that really isn’t Christian – and Mr. Huckabee is definitely a huckster of just that kind of perverted religion. Worshipping God is not about memorizing Bible verses and peddling your religion to the exclusion of common sense – Jesus said, in essence, “Love God. Love your neighbor. Everything else is commentary.” I get that. Mike Huckabee doesn’t, and you do not appear to, either.

    • It’s sad to know that some people are deluded enough to take a horrible tragedy and call the unholy slaughter of elementary school children a “warning from God.” What kind of bloodthirsty throwback are you worshiping?

  98. I guess this is the new American generation. In spite of this terrible carnage and warning from God, we still hold to our pride and arrogance.

  99. If you think Mike Huckabee doesn’t care about the impoverished or the quality of education in America, then you just don’t know him at all and she be better educated before you accuse someone of such. While your point is beautifully and respectfully made, it doesn’t accurately reflect what He said. And it’s a bit idealistic as there are constant stories about the name Jesus not even being allowed to be spoken in public schools and all religiously affiliated groups being banned from the schools. That shows a clear hostility to God in a time when we need to embrace God and His love. If Adama Lanza had KNOWN God’s love, KNOWN who he was in Christ, KNOWN how God loves all of us equally, then he would not have killed others and then himself.

    • This is beautifully written and I agree with you on all points. The Bible is very clear about “fools”. Eyes are not open, and clearly, this writer’s are not. She writes intelligently but has missed many of Mr. Huckabee’s points…frustrating.

      • She has missed very little yes Mr. Huckabee is give loving Christian man but so are many of the teacher that support yhese children, who may or may not be see my GOD taught me to love all people and show them the way. The way to do this may NOT always be by beating people up for thier difference but love them through them. God Bless

    • Huckabee’s argument falls flat and is rendered useless by one glaring fact….there is no god. It’s a fantasy created by humans to feel safe and to then be led by other men.

      Besides….how does the reverand explain all the shootings within good christian churches?? I guess god was on vacation when those killings happened inside of HIS house.

      https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=577844965564292&set=a.175433615805431.54851.169541156394677&type=1&theater

      • Well, the Bible says that the fool has said in his heart there is no God, and let the ignorant be ignorant still.

      • Yes yes, Francis…spare me…..remember that the bible says

        “Now therefore kill every male among the little ones, and kill every woman that hath known man by lying with him.

        But all the women children, that have not known a man by lying with him, keep alive for yourselves.”

        Sounds like your god has a history of telling his flock to murder the innocent children

  100. Amazing that we live in a time where the very mention of God brings about the type of anger, rage, hatred, and sheer intolerance as displayed in the letter written to Mr. Huckabee and some of the responses contained herein.One only need note all of the thank you’s from atheists, agnostics, etc. It’s very telling and indicative of a lost culture. Mike Huckabee voiced his opinion and I believe we here in America, even us who are the despised “Christian” segment, still have that right to do so.This life is but a dress rehearsal for the hereafter. If any of you thinks that God will not be completely immersed in everything we see, think, or do while learning from God, you’re sorely mistaken. God created this world, it’s HIS. Being a co-inheritor that makes it and everything in it, MINE also. I’ll speak out and so will the Mike Huckabee’s as much and as often as we choose. To do anything less would to turn our backs on the truth. This country glorifies violence, sex, abortion just to mention a few. The public school system is a liberal bastion of humanism. My suggestion to all christian (TRUE CHRISTIAN) parents is to take their children out of the public school system and either home school them or send them to a private school. Let the Godless left have their glorified sink holes they call schools. Let them raise taxes, spend like crazy.. Let them have it all.. It’s time for those of us who love the Lord to live our lives and take care of our families. Christ talks about being able to read the signs of the times. He’s returning soon.. We must forgive in our hearts and remember that no matter what, God is still in control. God bless Mike Huckabee for being a voice in the dark. Protect he and his family Lord and give them peace. In Jesus name.. Amen.

      • I didn’t write the word.. I’m sorry you have a problem with the bible which CLEARLY states the only way is through his son Jesus Christ.

      • Your bible, Tat, not mine. The bible is not the constitution. It’s great that you want to use it as a guideline for your life, but for a lot of us, it’s just a book of interesting stories and morality plays.

    • SO TRUE but which Christainity do you want. If the Westboro Baptist Church walked up to me I would fear thier teachimg, I also don’t want Mormonism, also not a Cathalic, not Jewish either. My problem is I don’t want another Religion taught to my children.

    • I’m actually completely fine with the Christian Right seceding and forming their own country so they can live under the Word of God (as they see it, anyway). You can call it the “Christian States of America”. Be sure to pick the deep south states, though, as our national deficit would decrease if we got rid of those (they consistently take more federal money than they supply in taxable revenue).

      Also, you can’t take Texas.

      But other than that, you’re good to go. Have fun waiting for the Rapture!

    • True Christians are tolerant. True Christians do not say things like, “I didn’t write the word.. I’m sorry you have a problem with the bible which CLEARLY states the only way is through his son Jesus Christ,” which suggests that everyone unlike them is CLEARY living in the wrong. True Christians work for the betterment of society, not only their own. True Chrisitians live by example, not exclusion.

      Whoever you are Tat, I feel so sorry for you. How daark and sad your life must be as you cast such judgement (which True Chrisitans know is truly only the task of God) on all those around you.

      There is no anger in this post, no rage, no hatred. It is a real account of what teachers choose to do as part of their job – every day. Beware of casting your angry stones from your house of glass.

  101. Here is my own personal opinion and also what I believe Mike Huckabee was attempting to state as well. I do not feel that if there was prayer in school that this shooting could not or would not have happened. Our society and nation for the most part has chosen to turn away from God in many ways. This progression away from God has been going on for quite awhile now and seems to be even getting worse at an alarming rate. This fact has also has brought about a demoralization of the United States. Certain things that were considered morally wrong in our nation’s history are not acceptable in the eyes of our society. The shooter at Newtown as well as the shooters in other recent shootings and such are a product of our decaying morals. Now, as I said before… this is my opinion. I am not saying other opinions are wrong but I do feel that the problem will only become worse because our society has either chosen to or has allowed, mainly under the banner of so-called tolerance, for the squelching of just about anything that has to do with God. I agree that God has never left. God is always everywhere. God did not create this problem… we did. Christians are also to blame… as we stepped back and just allowed a minority to run over us and our beliefs. They use the word ‘tolerance’ and tell us we offend some people by by our symbols, prayer and so on. Well, what about their tolerance? I am offended by people that are not tolerant of my own Christian beliefs. I am sick and tired of people saying that we can’t display our beliefs openly. If people don’t believe in God… why do they put so much effort into proving He doesn’t exist? If that’s how you feel… let’s be fair then… let’s start having banning Santa Claus and the Easter Bunny… they actually don’t exist.

    • Thank you Tat. I am a concerned Christian and believe everything Mike Huckabee was trying to get across to this Nation. We should put God first and above everything we do in our life.

      • A proven fact that a god exists? Please offer the data which supports your assertion.

        If you don’t like that, we’ll try something else. It’s a proven fact that Zeus exists and the he is superior to all other deities. Prove me wrong.

    • I’m starting to sound like a broken record here, but I really must point out that we are the only developed nation in the world that is so religious. Canada, Sweden, Norway, Germany, take your pick. They are all MUCH less religious than we are. Now go look at their social statistics. Dramatically lower rates of gun violence and other violent crime, much lower gang activity, far fewer teen pregnancies, less psychopathic episodes like this one.

      You simply do. not. have. any. evidence. that more God is what we need. You might believe it, but that’s not good enough. You’re going to have to convince those of us who study these things that somehow we have it all wrong and, contrary to what the unbiased numbers are telling us, what we really need is somehow the OPPOSITE of what everyone else is doing who seem to be more successful.

      You can’t convince us of that, because all you have is your beliefs. Meanwhile, as Nate Silver should have demonstrated to you, evil things like math, science, statistics, and reality have a well-known liberal bias. :)

      Also, I really don’t care if you’re offended, and neither does anyone else. So what? Quit whining. You CHOOSE to believe in and advocate for your religion. You’re going to have people who think you’re nuts and who you piss off. We’re going to call you on it. You don’t have the right not to be offended. I’m putting my beliefs out there, and people may respond and offend me. Well it’ll sting and then I’ll get over it. I certainly won’t whine about it like a victim.

      Wait, isn’t that what conservatives usually tell liberals when THEY whine about being offended? Oh, right, it’s ok to complain about being offended when it’s about YOUR beliefs.

    • You can display your beliefs all you want. Just don’t use my tax money to pay for it.

      FYI, someone I know was accosted in a store and berated for wishing the cashier “Happy Holidays” instead of Merry Christmas. Believe it or not, most of us who say this do so because 1) we want to wish someone well and 2) there are many holidays celebrated this time of year and not everyone clebrates all of them, but many celebrate more than one. Despite this Christian persecution complex, most of us really aren’t making a policial statement or trying to be politically correct or even insulting to Christians or anyone else. We simply want to wish someone enjoyment of the many holidays that occur this time of year, whichever they choose to celebrate.

      Many religions have celebrations at this time of year, not just Christians. And Christmas has become just as much a secular holiday as a religious one. Go ahead and have a religious celebration if you choose, but don’t disparage those who celebrate in a secular way. Their celebration of family, love, giving, peace, and goodwill are just as valid as your celebration of the birth of Christ. Anyone who gets bent over how someone wishes them well is missing the entire point of the well-wishes in the first place!

  102. A first grade was asked to write about someone she loved for a Veterans Day program at an elementary school here in Western NC. She wrote about her grandfathers (one died one living) and about how they carried a prayer rock with them into battle and before they went into battle how they would rub that rock and pray for God’s protection. A parent complained she had God on her story and the school superintendent made the principal have the little girl remove the word God (her story) and the students could not sing God Bless America because it might offend someone. Huckabee is right. Maybe not in your school but it is happening all across America. More often than you know. Now people are suggesting teachers carry guns? Prayer in school will not stop killings. Gun control will not stop killings. People’s value of life and God in their hearts, love for each other will help. Government needs to support mental health more. It has been cut and cut and cut. I say God Bless America and touch the lives of those that are suffering.

  103. Most public schools are failing miserably. It’s a fact, not an opinion. Yes, there are wonderful teachers out there, but there are so many unsuccessful ones that are almost impossible to remove from the classroom. This “PTA mother” is trying to make teachers and school staff in general seem like angels sent from heaven…and yes, some are! Some are NOT. The responsibility of teachers is to TEACH. Children should be cared for and taught morals at home. What is wrong with our society that we have hungry abused children attending our schools? We live in the land of plenty. There is enough for everyone, but it is ignorance that plagues the poor in money and love. This ignorance can only be addressed with religion. It’s what people pass on to their children…a code to live by that brings happiness and peace. ANY religion that promotes good moral standards is better than none. Wake up people. Stop the cycle.

  104. What an incredible piece of bs. She is talking about something not even remotely related to the main point.

  105. The sad thing is that everyone is fighting over this… This is a time to morn, a time to pray for our children! NOT  a time to say my way or your way! I am a Christian, and I do believe in God…. The people on here saying that we as Christians want religion back into our schools you are right! But we all know it won’t happen because people like you won’t let it! You say we are forcing or God on you, but your wrong you are forcing your ways on us! We as Christians have had enough and that’s all! It should be our right if we want our children to pray at school that they should feel free to do so! WITHOUT peoples criticism! 
    Many people think different! I agree with the letter that God hasn’t left our schools  and he is there through our Teachers!  But only if he is asked! With that said my heart goes out to all the families affected by this! Please know that God was with your children holding them and loving them all, as we should all be doing now! God bless you all and please have a Merry CHRISTmas!

    • I hate to be childish, but you started it ;-)

      Seriously, it wasn’t more than an hour before I saw the first snarky “Where was I? You won’t allow me in schools, remember? — God” post. Along with those were posts blaming atheists, liberals, Democrats, and pretty much everyone not an evangelical conservative Protestant.

      Where was all the hate coming from the moment this happened? The same place it always comes from when tragedies happen: the Religious Right.

      We are, quite frankly, tired of you. And I’m proud of PTA Mom for being one of a few mainstream and/or liberal Christians who are standing up to your bullying. We have allowed your fundamentalist angry brand of Christianity to become the de-facto spokesman for all Christians for FAR too long. You’ve created far more atheists than Christians with your perverse “reverse witnessing”.

      The rest of this country (read: the vast majority of us), whether Christian or Deist or atheist or any other faith, have had it with your rhetoric.

      We’re done with you.

    • You can pray in school all you like. You just can’t make anyone else pray with you. If you want prayer in school, put your kids in a Christian school. That’s what they’re there for. Public school is not your personal religious pulpit.

  106. Simply stated (and by her own words), this womans god is a different god from the One in Gov. Huckabee’s bible (which is the same God in my bible) and her god is a different god from the One Gov. Huckabee prays to (which is also the God I pray to). Maybe making up our own gods is part of the problem?

  107. While i understand the heart and intent of the letter, I have to say, you didn’t listen to Mr. Huckabee. I too have worked in the public school system. I have a different role as I am an interpreter for Deaf children rather than a teacher. This affords me a different view of what is happening in our classrooms. I see many teachers that do really good things. I have some lovely Christian friends who work in the school system. You are right that God is in the school, but it is not because the school system as a whole wants Him there. Instead it is in spite of the school systems vehement efforts to kick Him out. I listened to a teacher who was severely reprimanded because he had a Christian speak in his classroom. Now, maybe you are saying, “Well, you wouldn’t want a Muslim to speak,” Well, he had a Muslim, a Wiccan, and other religions also….the only reprimand he received was because of the one Christian. I have seen much more freedom for other religions, so you need to be careful making the accusations that some of you have made above. Furthermore, I have been warned that I could possibly lose my job if I read my Bible, on my own time, in the schools. I have been told that I had to turn around during student initiated prayer because I shouldn’t be “promoting” my religion. Another teacher was told she couldn’t have a Bible with her other books on her desk. The reason God is in these schools is only because Christians bring Him with them, not because He is welcomed.

    Someone mentioned that churches weren’t doing what they should be doing for the poor and needy children. You are right. Many are not, but some are. Don’t make a blanket accusation. However, we need to be doing more. I applaud those in the school system that strive to make a difference, but doing good deeds is not the same as teaching children a respect and fear of an almighty God. Not everyone has to be a Christian. Our forefathers were not all Christians, but you will notice (if you honestly go back and study) that they had a healthy respect for God. When you realize that there is a Supreme Being that you will one day have to answer to, it makes you more leery of doing things like we see so much today. As I said, I see the kids and the classrooms differently because I sit in the middle of them. Often times, they forget I am even there (which is the way it should be). They talk in front of me, and I hear the loss of God. The school teaches them they are animals…simply evolved for no real purpose. The system teaches them that they have little control over themselves by giving out birth control rather than teaching them to be responsible. They tell them that life isn’t sacred. I have heard them when they forget I am there….They believe it. They act on it. And we mourn the loss.

  108. I’ll start leading my students in prayer from the Koran. What’s that? The Bible? Oh! Well, go back and learn your history. Christian prayer and scriptural teaching in public schools would absolutely violate the principles upon which this nation was founded. I am a Christian, but my own children will form their relationship with God and their understanding of scripture IN CHURCH!

  109. This. This is a thing of beauty. Had me crying multiple times. I know it’s not officially teacher appreciation week, but let me just go on record as saying my teachers were definitely instruments in God’s hands. Time and time again they did what they could to protect me from what I was experiencing at home. Day in and day out they gave me love and encouragement, something lacking in my sad little life. They truly were the best examples of Christ like behavior that I experienced as a child. I give thanks for my public school teachers. Every one of them.

  110. Your very first paragraph is based on a lie. Mr. Huckabee never said that the shooting occurred because this nation has removed God from our schools. Maybe you could write your “letter” based on actually listening to his speech rather than social media posts about it. Despite your absolutely untrue first sentences, I continued to read. What a mistake.
    Please explain where God is seen in a school that teaches its students that this beautifully intricate world wasn’t created by Him but rather formed of its own volition and eventually evolved into what it is today. How can you say that Jesus is portrayed in a school that teaches its students that they evolved from nothing and somehow became such immaculately-designed humans. Your open letter is a complete fabrication reflecting the humanistic mindset that pervades today’s culture, the antithesis of a culture that reflects God and His values.

    • It’s called “leading by example.” Suppose we allowed teaching of the Muslim Gospel, hmm? Do you support that, too? Or perhaps the Wiccan spell book (or whatever they use – no disrespect intended)?

  111. Does God’s existence depend on whether or not we believe in God? If God is, regardless of whether or not we believe, then how can we possibly be arrogant enough to presume that we have the power to “push God” anywhere? Seems to me God will be anywhere God chooses to be. We can push and squeeze all we want, but God remains who God is. Our schools are not houses of worship. The Bible belongs to the Judeo-Christian community and is not a text book for the general public. Our schools are not the place to teach or enforce any particular brand of religion. That’s not what our children are there for. If you want your kids to be taught a particular faith, get up off your ass and take them to a church or religious community and get involved with them. By the way, I’m incredibly grateful that our schools are prohibited from “teaching God” in the school setting. I sure wouldn’t want my children learning about the god many of you claim to believe in. Nor would I want them to be forced to pray to your version of “God.” Shall we have our children worship and pray to the god of the Westboro Baptist Church? They claim to be Christians. Would you want those “Christians” teaching your children about “God?” Here’s a newsflash, Mike Huckabee and all of you who think “God” belongs in our schools: God has always been there. Always will be. Open your minds and think with love, not fear.

    • Here is a comment I left with a friend… While I understand and agree with you that none of us want a doctrine of hate to be taught in the schools such as Westboro seems to espouse, it would not hurt to return to the system that we grew up with that encouraged discipline, accountability, patriotism to our country, faith in God (the Pledge of the Allegiance), ethics… And since so many of the children of the public educational system do not have the opportunity to go to a church like yours (parents non-belief, absent or just don’t care), they have to rely on lay people that you have hopefully taught or that have searched the scriptures and share it in a balanced way with love… Here is what I wrote.. and if I understand right we have been charged with the commission of sharing our faith, not just in deed, but in word also… The children of today need to know of God who never leaves them, nor forsakes them… I don’t think God has been taken out of the schools, his spirit still lives within many who teach… It is just unfortunate that the administration of the schools won’t allow teacher’s to use the scriptures which is socially beneficial to the students. The 10 commandments and the Golden Rule were for societies benefit and would be good to teach children from the time they are able to learn showing them how to interact. Along with other beneficial scriptures in which God says he will never leave, nor forsake us… Teachers hands have been tied by a knee-jerk administration who tries to solve every problem with a new policy that doesn’t work… As early as 1st grade when we were kids (early 60′s), we were taught accountability, discipline and how to relate to our fellow students… Government and the school administration never hindered that then… Thank You, Ms. Robinette (RIP) for your willingness to teach the things that our schools are not allowed to share now… but now the powers to be don’t allow the teachers to share those important things outside of their curriculum… Someone we both knew, Mr. Nicholas taught me much more than music… Look at the great example he was, the discipline he taught, sharing his faith through the songs of the faith we sang, etc… I am not so sure teachers in the public school system have that much flexibility any more… And for you guys, that is a shame… I simply think that Mike Huckabee was trying to take an honest look at how the government and school administrators have molded the schools to take any mention of God or Jesus Christ out of the school system… or anything related to the bible… I do pray that God continues to bless the teachers who stay within the system because you are the only salt and light in an institution that seems to becoming darker and darker and which influences future generations. generations… When you take the light out of a room, all that is left is darkness… When you take any mention of God, Jesus Christ or the Bible out of any society you will be left without any civility, guidance, ethics, charity… Everything then becomes relative, if it feels good do it… It’s not your fault, it is your parents, or your simply a product of your envirionment ie societies fault…

      • Two points (one that I’ve made elsewhere):

        1. You may not be used to writing longer things, but you should be aware that most people probably did not read what you wrote. It isn’t because they didn’t want to hear it, but because of a lack of paragraphs. Go back and look at your post and you’ll see that it looks like one impenetrable wall of text. Please practice structuring your thoughts better because all of that emotion and passion and thought that you poured into your words will not matter if no one reads it.

        2. Your argument does not accord with the evidence. Pick a developed country other than ours. Canada, Sweden, Norway, Germany. You can do it almost at random. Two things will be apparent: first, they have a better educated public and dramatically lower per-capita rates of violent crime, gang activity, and thinks like teen pregnancy; second, they are almost exclusively liberal and increasingly atheistic. This evidence simply demolishes the Christian Right’s claim that what we need is more fundamentalist Christianity in our schools and our nation. It’s just wrong. No evidence. Zero.

  112. I applaud what you and your school system has accomplished. However, these wonderful acts of goodness can only go so far. What young people need is to develop a PERSONAL RELATIONSHIP with God. Needless to say, they may surely develop a great personal relationship with those working within the school system, but this kind of relationship falls far short of a personal relationship with Christ. He is the only Being who can prepare and show a young person the way to everlasting life. As the Bible declares, “Christ is the WAY, the TRUTH, and the LIFE.” This is a degree of spirituality that no earthly individual possesses. The BEST educators this world can produce cannot save a soul, this work only God’s Spirit can accomplish. As they say, “The shortest distance between two points is a straight line,” The best way to accomplish this is to be able to point our young people, DIRECTLY to the presence of God. This the school systems can no longer accomplish as it did when I attended the Public School System. Teachers prayed with us, and sang Christian songs with their students, During our Assembly moments, the principle would offen read Biblical text, and encourage the students to live a good and whole-some life. In my personal opinion, this is what made the WW2 generation, the greatest generation. Our current generation is headed in only one direction, and they are becoming a generation RIPE for destruction. What a sad commentary to say,…regarding this generation, but it is TRUE indeed!

    • I would like to point out two issues with your comments, one “external” and one “internal”.

      First, the “external” one: the simplest problem with your argument is your underlying assumption that reintroducing Christianity into our schools would somehow make us “better”. In other words, it would lower crime, increase morality, and so on. The problem is this is not supported by evidence. Other nations around the world (like Canada, Sweden, Norway, and so forth) have BETTER education systems with FAR less violence, gang behavior, teen pregnancy, and so on. Yet, they are usually atheist or “mainstream Christian” (the Christmas – Easter kind). And they certainly don’t have school-endorsed Christianity. You simply can’t explain why God seems to be so badly needed in our country and not in others.

      Second, the “internal” one: you mentioned in public school you had prayer sessions, sang Christian songs, and performed other Christian activities. I’m sure this was very warm and fuzzy to you; very comforting. But instead, imagine that you had been born in Utah to a Protestant Family. You went to a public school that constantly praised Joseph Smith, held “bonus” lessons on the Golden Plates, and prayed every morning that you too could become the God of Planet Kolob. You tell your mom about this. She tells you to refuse to participate. You do this but now you’re being given the stinky eye by your teachers. Your grades fall inexplicably. You’re forced to write an essay on why Mormonism is the most logical religion. You fail that because you refuse. Your peers bully you because you aren’t “one of them”. Too bad you picked the wrong parents, enjoy your living hell until graduation.

      You see how easy it is for your “God in schools” plan to backfire? What if, contrary to all common sense, Obama really IS a secret Muslim. What if he “allows” the Christians to tear down church-state separation and then forces children to read the Kuran after reciting the Pledge of Allegiance (as “One nation, under Allah.”)?

      You see, you THINK you want this. But you don’t. The reason we don’t allow the government to endorse religion is to PROTECT religion, not to outlaw it. So go ahead, continue to lobby for prayer in our schools. Just don’t be surprised if we’re only one crazy election cycle away from putting what you think is the WRONG God in there.

      Thank you for your time.

    • And what of all those non-christian children? I don’t believe as you do and I do not want anyone telling my children that they have to believe in your version of salvation. The public schools in Europe do NOT teach religion and yet they do a far better job at educating our children, Take a look at Sweden. Only 25% of their population believes In G-d, and last year they had 40 deaths from guns in the entire country. The US has 90% who say they believe and yet we had over 10,000. Somehow I think it has nothing to do with your version of G-d.

    • Nonsense. In a public school, funded by taxpayers, there should be no one imposed religion, and that is precisely what you are suggesting. We have, in this country, the constitutional principal that the government should not establish any one religion. It is not the educator’s job to save souls, it is their job to feed and nurture developing minds. If you want your children to have an education where they also have indoctrinating religious instruction, there is nothing keeping you from sending your children to a private school. Whatever religious instruction there might be in the public schools should be factual, and should teach children to respect other people’s religious traditions. They don’t have to believe in, they don’t even have to like the world’s other religions. But they do have to be respectful. Your attitude of Christian Supremacy is exceptionally offputting, and is not the least bit appropriate in state, taxpayer funded public schools. I say this as a Christian pastor. The place for religious education is at church, and in the home.

    • And they can develop that ‘personal relationship with God’ in the house of worship of their choice. There are so many religions represented by the populations of schools that it is so hard to be fair to any of them by only representing the one that YOU adhere to. Be respectful of our neighbors that do not worship in exactly the same way you do. Develop a Christian world view and love and respect your neighbor the way Jesus would want you to.

    • which god did you have in mind. collective for all the faiths? and if a family is agnostic, athiest? What about the Jewish kid being made to sing christian songs? THe muslim kid having to play in the christmas let me try that again, the nativity story.

    • Let me ask you a question, Mr. Marsala. Do you really think that if Jesus were here today, he would take a look at people who are giving hungry kids food to eat, who are teaching them to read and understand things, and who are providing them with a place to spend their days that is as safe and stable as they can make it–would Jesus Christ take a look at those people and say, “They’d be doing a good job if only they talked about ME more”?

      If you really think that he would, then the Jesus you have a personal relationship with is a very different one from the one I met reading the Bible.

      • Thank you so much Alex. I may quote you, because I love this: “would Jesus Christ take a look at those people and say, “They’d be doing a good job if only they talked about ME more”? ”

        I agree and I wish more people would be Christ-like in their actions. It would make for a happier place and less of this name calling.

    • That is where a parent comes in. What if the teacher is Muslim do you want that taught to your “Christian” child? I am betting not. You are assuming everyone in the world is the same as you are and that is pretty narrow minded. What if they happen to be Pagan should that teacher teach about The Earth Mother? You do not have the only relegion on Earth get out more and you will realize this.